UK postcode database

[John A Stevenson]

The UK postcode database has been posted on Wikileaks.

Now, just like a TomTom(TM) or GoogleEarth(TM), you too can find the
lat-lon of any address in the UK.

http://wikileaks.org/wiki/UK_government_database_of_all_1,841,177_post_codes_together_with_precise_geographic_coordinates_and_other_information,_8_Jul_2009

Have fun,

John

--


Dr John Stevenson
Postdoctoral Research Associate
School of Earth, Atmospheric and Environmental Sciences
Williamson Building (Room 2.42)
University of Manchester
Manchester M13 9PL, UK
tel. [phone]; fax. [phone];
[hidden email]

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[Barry Rowlingson]

On Mon, Sep 21, 2009 at 3:55 PM, John A Stevenson
<[hidden email]> wrote:
> The UK postcode database has been posted on Wikileaks.
>
> Now, just like a TomTom(TM) or GoogleEarth(TM), you too can find the lat-lon
> of any address in the UK.
>
> http://wikileaks.org/wiki/UK_government_database_of_all_1,841,177_post_codes_together_with_precise_geographic_coordinates_and_other_information,_8_Jul_2009

 What's the difference between that and:

 "A torrent file of MS Office has been put on www.thepiratebay.org,
now you too can write documents and make spreadsheets"

 Whatever we may think of open government and open data, I think the
postcode database is still copyright material and distribution via
wikileaks or any other mechanism is surely legally dubious.

 ObDisclaimer: I am not a lawyer...

Barry
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[Andrew Larcombe]

On 21 Sep 2009, at 16:40, Barry Rowlingson wrote:

> On Mon, Sep 21, 2009 at 3:55 PM, John A Stevenson
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> The UK postcode database has been posted on Wikileaks.
>>
>> Now, just like a TomTom(TM) or GoogleEarth(TM), you too can find  
>> the lat-lon
>> of any address in the UK.
>>
>> http://wikileaks.org/wiki/ 
>> UK_government_database_of_all_1,841,177_post_codes_together_with_prec
>> ise_geographic_coordinates_and_other_information,_8_Jul_2009
>
>  What's the difference between that and:
>
>  "A torrent file of MS Office has been put on www.thepiratebay.org,
> now you too can write documents and make spreadsheets"
>
>  Whatever we may think of open government and open data, I think the
> postcode database is still copyright material and distribution via
> wikileaks or any other mechanism is surely legally dubious.

Your analogy doesn't quite hold up as there are many ways to create  
documents and spreadsheets, but only one source of data for postcodes.

It is still copyright though etc...

Cheers,

A

--
Andrew Larcombe
Freelance Geospatial, Database & Web Programming




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[Jo Cook]

Now this brings up an interesting dilemma- thanks to John for starting it off!

On one hand, the UK chapter has a policy of only supporting and documenting data that is legally freely available, and I think we'd be unwilling to include anything from wikileaks in that list. However, it's incredibly useful data that's hard to obtain from any other source, and as someone said recently, perhaps even about the same leak- you can't put the toothpaste back in the tube. I hope that this disclosure leads to a better and more open system in future.

Jo
----- Original Message -----
From: "Andrew Larcombe" <[hidden email]>
To: "osgeo-uk" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, 21 September, 2009 17:03:39 GMT +00:00 GMT Britain, Ireland, Portugal
Subject: Re: [OSGeo-UK] UK postcode database


On 21 Sep 2009, at 16:40, Barry Rowlingson wrote:

> On Mon, Sep 21, 2009 at 3:55 PM, John A Stevenson
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> The UK postcode database has been posted on Wikileaks.
>>
>> Now, just like a TomTom(TM) or GoogleEarth(TM), you too can find  
>> the lat-lon
>> of any address in the UK.
>>
>> http://wikileaks.org/wiki/ 
>> UK_government_database_of_all_1,841,177_post_codes_together_with_prec
>> ise_geographic_coordinates_and_other_information,_8_Jul_2009
>
>  What's the difference between that and:
>
>  "A torrent file of MS Office has been put on www.thepiratebay.org,
> now you too can write documents and make spreadsheets"
>
>  Whatever we may think of open government and open data, I think the
> postcode database is still copyright material and distribution via
> wikileaks or any other mechanism is surely legally dubious.

Your analogy doesn't quite hold up as there are many ways to create  
documents and spreadsheets, but only one source of data for postcodes.

It is still copyright though etc...

Cheers,

A

--
Andrew Larcombe
Freelance Geospatial, Database & Web Programming




_______________________________________________
UK mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/uk


--
-----------------------------------------------------
Joanne Cook
Senior IT Support and Development
Oxford Archaeology (North)
01524 880212
http://thehumanjourney.net


------
Files attached to this email may be in ISO 26300 format (OASIS Open Document Format). If you have difficulty opening them, please visit http://iso26300.info for more information.

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[Tom (JDi Solutions)]

Hi all,

Just in case anyone is in any doubt, it is absolutely illegal to use this data without a license.  Perhaps a better analogy is that of downloading an album from thepiratebay because this is data that has been created by someone and protected by copyright as a result.  If you didn't pay for the album you're not legally allowed to download it, the same is true of the postcode data.  Of course it's very useful but Royal Mail have got a history of pursuing people who attempt to use this stuff illegally.  It's a real shame, personally I'm on the side of the freeourdata campaign but until that bears fruit I would advise people not to touch this.  Especially for use in the public domain.

Tom

On Mon, Sep 21, 2009 at 5:41 PM, Joanne Cook <[hidden email]> wrote:

Now this brings up an interesting dilemma- thanks to John for starting it off!

On one hand, the UK chapter has a policy of only supporting and documenting data that is legally freely available, and I think we'd be unwilling to include anything from wikileaks in that list. However, it's incredibly useful data that's hard to obtain from any other source, and as someone said recently, perhaps even about the same leak- you can't put the toothpaste back in the tube. I hope that this disclosure leads to a better and more open system in future.

Jo

----- Original Message -----
From: "Andrew Larcombe" <[hidden email]>
To: "osgeo-uk" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, 21 September, 2009 17:03:39 GMT +00:00 GMT Britain, Ireland, Portugal
Subject: Re: [OSGeo-UK] UK postcode database


On 21 Sep 2009, at 16:40, Barry Rowlingson wrote:

> On Mon, Sep 21, 2009 at 3:55 PM, John A Stevenson
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> The UK postcode database has been posted on Wikileaks.
>>
>> Now, just like a TomTom(TM) or GoogleEarth(TM), you too can find
>> the lat-lon
>> of any address in the UK.
>>
>> http://wikileaks.org/wiki/
>> UK_government_database_of_all_1,841,177_post_codes_together_with_prec
>> ise_geographic_coordinates_and_other_information,_8_Jul_2009
>
>  What's the difference between that and:
>
>  "A torrent file of MS Office has been put on www.thepiratebay.org,
> now you too can write documents and make spreadsheets"
>
>  Whatever we may think of open government and open data, I think the
> postcode database is still copyright material and distribution via
> wikileaks or any other mechanism is surely legally dubious.

Your analogy doesn't quite hold up as there are many ways to create
documents and spreadsheets, but only one source of data for postcodes.

It is still copyright though etc...

Cheers,

A

--
Andrew Larcombe
Freelance Geospatial, Database & Web Programming




_______________________________________________
UK mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/uk

--
-----------------------------------------------------
Joanne Cook
Senior IT Support and Development
Oxford Archaeology (North)
01524 880212
http://thehumanjourney.net


------
Files attached to this email may be in ISO 26300 format (OASIS Open Document Format). If you have difficulty opening them, please visit http://iso26300.info for more information.

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[Charles Arnot]

Some javascript/style in this post has been disabled (why?)

Hi all,

 

Just to be pedantic on the analogy front, the Pirate Bay analogy is not accurate, if you download something from a torrent site like Pirate Bay, you will be downloading a small torrent file which is not illegal. If you then use the torrent file with a torrent client to download what ever target file the torrent is distributing (i.e. a film, postcode data etc.)  you will be illegally distributing the target file (if it is copyrighted material) because of the nature of a peer to peer distribution network in which you both download and upload the target file to/from other peoples computers simultaneously.

 

In the case of wiki leaks if you chose to download the postcode data you are not simultaneously uploading it over a peer to peer network and therefore not actively distributing it.

 

It’s therefore not the same.

 

As to whether it’s illegal just to download copyright material I’m not sure if the act itself is illegal. It is though, as we are all aware, an infringement to have unlicensed/out of licence material on your computer so it’s a mute point.

 

Maybe this is a good opportunity to discuss what open source/free geocoding resources there are out there.

 

I have use this site ‘http://www.batchgeocode.com/’ to batch geocode uk address with some degree of success (about a 80% match), no doubt there are better options available?

 

 

Charlie

 

 

---

From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Tom (JDi Solutions)
Sent: 22 September 2009 11:02
To: Joanne Cook
Cc: osgeo-uk
Subject: Re: [OSGeo-UK] UK postcode database

 

Hi all,

Just in case anyone is in any doubt, it is absolutely illegal to use this data without a license.  Perhaps a better analogy is that of downloading an album from thepiratebay because this is data that has been created by someone and protected by copyright as a result.  If you didn't pay for the album you're not legally allowed to download it, the same is true of the postcode data.  Of course it's very useful but Royal Mail have got a history of pursuing people who attempt to use this stuff illegally.  It's a real shame, personally I'm on the side of the freeourdata campaign but until that bears fruit I would advise people not to touch this.  Especially for use in the public domain.

Tom

On Mon, Sep 21, 2009 at 5:41 PM, Joanne Cook <[hidden email]> wrote:

Now this brings up an interesting dilemma- thanks to John for starting it off!

On one hand, the UK chapter has a policy of only supporting and documenting data that is legally freely available, and I think we'd be unwilling to include anything from wikileaks in that list. However, it's incredibly useful data that's hard to obtain from any other source, and as someone said recently, perhaps even about the same leak- you can't put the toothpaste back in the tube. I hope that this disclosure leads to a better and more open system in future.

Jo

----- Original Message -----
From: "Andrew Larcombe" <[hidden email]>
To: "osgeo-uk" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, 21 September, 2009 17:03:39 GMT +00:00 GMT Britain, Ireland, Portugal
Subject: Re: [OSGeo-UK] UK postcode database


On 21 Sep 2009, at 16:40, Barry Rowlingson wrote:

> On Mon, Sep 21, 2009 at 3:55 PM, John A Stevenson
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> The UK postcode database has been posted on Wikileaks.
>>
>> Now, just like a TomTom(TM) or GoogleEarth(TM), you too can find
>> the lat-lon
>> of any address in the UK.
>>
>> http://wikileaks.org/wiki/
>> UK_government_database_of_all_1,841,177_post_codes_together_with_prec
>> ise_geographic_coordinates_and_other_information,_8_Jul_2009
>
>  What's the difference between that and:
>
>  "A torrent file of MS Office has been put on www.thepiratebay.org,
> now you too can write documents and make spreadsheets"
>
>  Whatever we may think of open government and open data, I think the
> postcode database is still copyright material and distribution via
> wikileaks or any other mechanism is surely legally dubious.

Your analogy doesn't quite hold up as there are many ways to create
documents and spreadsheets, but only one source of data for postcodes.

It is still copyright though etc...

Cheers,

A

--
Andrew Larcombe
Freelance Geospatial, Database & Web Programming




_______________________________________________
UK mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/uk

--
-----------------------------------------------------
Joanne Cook
Senior IT Support and Development
Oxford Archaeology (North)
01524 880212
http://thehumanjourney.net


------
Files attached to this email may be in ISO 26300 format (OASIS Open Document Format). If you have difficulty opening them, please visit http://iso26300.info for more information.

_______________________________________________
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http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/uk

 

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