Request for help: Would like community applications to show and discuss at LinuxWorld

[Yorick Moko]

Just to let you know: I really like Tango GPS.

On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 5:26 PM, Tim Coggins <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 1:29 PM, Marcus Bauer <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> from tangogps. Moreover the '800 pound gorilla' OM is developing its own
>> gps software and I'm not spending my energy competing with it.
>>
>> OM2007.2 is there, it works and I recommend everybody to develop for it.
>
> Marcus, these two statements appear to contradict each other. Can you
> confirm you will continue to work on tangoGPS?
>
> In my opinion so far tangoGPS is the best and most mature application
> which I've got to run the Freerunner. It would be a great shame for
> the project to loose your leadership.
>
> I tried the ASU yesterday, roughly following what has now been written
> up in the "flash ASU" thread earlier today and as that thread details
> it's broken at the moment. I plan to stick with 2007.2 until one clear
> standard distribution is available and is kept in a reasonably stable
> state.
>
> Tim
>
> _______________________________________________
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>

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[Marcus Bauer]

On Tue, 2008-07-29 at 16:26 +0100, Tim Coggins wrote:
> On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 1:29 PM, Marcus Bauer <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > from tangogps. Moreover the '800 pound gorilla' OM is developing its own
> > gps software and I'm not spending my energy competing with it.
> >
> > OM2007.2 is there, it works and I recommend everybody to develop for it.
>
> Marcus, these two statements appear to contradict each other. Can you
> confirm you will continue to work on tangoGPS?

tangoGPS does run on many other platforms too, i.e. eeePC, your Desktop
(Debian, Ubuntu, SUSE, Fedora, Gentooo...). Alpha, amd64, hppa, ia64,
powerpc, mipsel, s390, sparc, freeBSD-386/amd64... ;-)

So yes, I'm continuing to work on it. What I meant is that OM develops
their own GPS app (splotter/density) and once it works well and it is
installed by default people will simply go and use it. Such is life and
I'm aware of it. Last not least density is the brainchild of Steve
([hidden email]) and he is quite proud of it. Thus there will be
funding for ongoing development.


> In my opinion so far tangoGPS is the best and most mature application
> which I've got to run the Freerunner. It would be a great shame for
> the project to loose your leadership.

Thanks for your remarks. I'll do my best to live up to it.

Marcus


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[Steve Mosher]

 marcus.

 BZZZZNT.............. I am not a sales guy.



 

 


 

 

 


 


-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Marcus Bauer
Sent: Monday, July 28, 2008 11:23 PM
To: List for Openmoko community discussion
Subject: RE: Request for help: Would like community applications to
showanddiscuss at LinuxWorld

On Tue, 2008-07-29 at 01:08 +0200, Kristian 'kriss' Mueller wrote:

> Am Dienstag, den 29.07.2008, 00:46 +0200 schrieb Marcus Bauer:
> > On Mon, 2008-07-28 at 15:33 -0700, steve wrote:
> > > Of course!!! Every toolkit  is allowed.
> > >
> > > The whole point about FSO is to free people to pick their toolkit!
> >
> > The opposite is true. FSO forces you into ASU. It basically makes
> > all work that has been put into OM2007.2 useless.
> >
> > Please stop telling these lies.
>
> Marcus, did I miss the irony here, or do you really believe this?

This is simply a matter of fact, not of believe. FSO is a shitty API
collection which is closely connected to ASU. Steve is a sales guy and has
not much clue of the underlying software, thus he simply repeats what others
told him.

The bad combination is NIH (not invented here) together with almightyness
thinking which results in all this religion here, making people like you ask
whether I "believe". I don't believe, I simply know.


> Why should anyone at Openmoko want to keep out other frameworks, after
> even putting qtopia to X11?

That was mostly Trolltech's work. And apart from that you technically can't
"keep out" any other toolkit because there is Linux below and X on top of
it.

But FSO combines plenty of different things into one collection of API's and
that is how the Microsoft world works and always did and which drove so many
developers to Linux. If I use Apache as webserver I can use Konqueror,
Opera, Safari or Firefox as browser. However, Microsoft has more than once
tried to tie Internet Explorer to IIS, giving it an advantage over other
browsers. Same goes for Microsoft Office and Windows.

To make it clear (and to prevent Wolfgang Spraul from alluding to incorrect
assumptions in case he should answer me): I welcome both qtopia on X11 and
an ETK based desktop and ETK based applications on the phone.

Linux is all about choice (and that is what freedom means): If I don't want
to, I don't have to. On my desktop computer I have a big choice of window
managers and they flawlessly work together with a big choice of browsers and
a big choice of webservers.

For all those teletubby fanbois who are now ready to jump on me: I'm the
developer of tangoGPS and have a decent clue what I'm talking about.

I'll ask you one question: why was there so much fighting in the free
software world about ODF versus Microsoft's OpenXML? I'll answer it for
you: because OpenXML ties people to MS Office.

FSO is the brainchild of Dr. Michael Lauer, fresh from the university's
ivory tower but lacking any industry experience. It is reinventing the wheel
and drains lots of ressources that are needed elsewhere inside of Openmoko.
It combines plenty of things out of which one is a new PIM API based on
dbus. This idea alone is worth to be mentioned every day for a year on the
dailyWTF website.

It is not about GTK or qt or ETK. It is about getting a working platform out
to users and developers. OM2007.2 was mostly there. It reminds me to a joke:

        Two fools try to escape from a lunatics hospital. There are 100
        walls to climb over and so they start: 10, 20, 50, 90, 99. In
        that moment says the one to the other: 'Lets go back and do the
        last wall tomorrow'.

...have fun and enjoy life and start looking at the Neo what it is: a tiny
Linux computer with a GPS and a GSM modem. There is no sudden revolution
going to happen tomorrow.

Freedom is a synonym for choice. The choice for your keyboard, for your
window manager, for you applications, last not least for your gsmd.

FIC/Openmoko came to support Linux on their hardware platform in order to
give you this choice. Now it has changed into some religious life-style
thingy with phantasies of becoming tomorrows ubiquitious lifestyle
equipment. Linux definitely will be, Openmoko can be part of it but thinking
that Openmoko is the only parent is just megalomania.

Come down to earth, stop excusing hardware flaws with "open" and "freedom",
just sit down and fix them and Openmoko hardware will have a bright future.

Best regards,
Marcus






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[Sean Moss-Pultz]

On 7/29/08 Marcus Bauer wrote:
> On Mon, 2008-07-28 at 15:33 -0700, steve wrote:
> > > Of course!!! Every toolkit  is allowed.
> > >
> > > The whole point about FSO is to free people to pick their toolkit!
>
> The opposite is true. FSO forces you into ASU. It basically makes all
> work that has been put into OM2007.2 useless.
>
> Please stop telling these lies.

Marcus

You do realize who you are talking to? This is person in charge of all
of marketing for Openmoko. If he says, "the point of something is..."
you should understand that he speaks for Openmoko. You can say what you
want about his ideas. But you have no basis whatsoever to say he's lieing.

So some respect.

   -Sean

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[Marcus Bauer]

On Wed, 2008-07-30 at 13:37 +0800, Sean Moss-Pultz wrote:

> On 7/29/08 Marcus Bauer wrote:
> > On Mon, 2008-07-28 at 15:33 -0700, steve wrote:
> > > > Of course!!! Every toolkit  is allowed.
> > > >
> > > > The whole point about FSO is to free people to pick their toolkit!
> >
> > The opposite is true. FSO forces you into ASU. It basically makes all
> > work that has been put into OM2007.2 useless.
> >
> > Please stop telling these lies.
>
> Marcus
>
> You do realize who you are talking to?

This is a childish question.

> This is person in charge of all
> of marketing for Openmoko. If he says, "the point of something is..."
> you should understand that he speaks for Openmoko.

If he would be the pope, then I would understand that he speaks for the
catholic church and when he says "the point of something is..." I would
know he is infallible by definition.

But if the marketing guy (not sales guy as he pointed out) makes wrong
technical statements I have enough authority to correct them. (Simply go
over to Wikipedia and check for the word meritocracy and its connection
to open source.)

And I allow myself to counter your question: Do you realize who *you*
are talking to?

I am part of your community and I have spent at least four full time
months of development for YOUR system. And opposed to you I am not paid.

If there is someone who should pay respect, how about you paying respect
to me?


> You can say what you
> want about his ideas. But you have no basis whatsoever to say he's lieing.

FSO has nothing to do with "freeing people to pick their toolkit".
OM2007.2 offers the phonekit and eds (evolution data server).

Both already allow for dbus abstraction and this whole argument is
stale. OpenedHand (the authors of OM2007.2) knew what they were doing:

        "OpenedHand is, IMHO, the most talented open source company in
        the world."

Those are your very own words Sean, picked from your website.

> So some respect.

I don't get your point here, Sean. Church-like respect is not what gets
things done. Having dreams is great, but then comes the point where you
need to wake up and deliver.

OM2007.2 is there, just lets use and refine it.
The Neo Freerunner is there, just lets use and refine it.
Since November 2006 we hear: "just a few more months".

There is no reason to wait for FSO and seeing how chaotic development
has been the past one and a half years I rather doubt that this will
ever be anything usable. It is a lot more important to get a community
of developers in here and a community of VAR (value added resellers).
And it is a lot more important to build up an ecosystem.

FSO is a questionable approach made by people with no industry
experience, fresh from university. I have to repeat that I would
strongly advise any third party developer to stay away from it.

Revive OM2007.2, spend time, energy and money for building an ecosystem
and get something out that others can build on. *Now*. Not in winter
2008 which then will be probaly summer 2009. Let your pet projects
FSO/ASU run in parallel and once they are there, the world will be
happy.

Do it like the ASUS eeePC. They didn't set out to change the world and
to compete with the MacBook Air. They have a rudimentary Linux System on
it and people love it. Many people even go on with the simple interface
while others reinstall their favourite system.

And yet ASUS started a revolution. Not because they follow their own
vision, but because they let people dream their own dreams.

Sean, on the one hand you talk about empty vessels and museums, on the
other hand fail to realize that it is already there. OM2007.2. Created
by the most talented open source company.

Staying in your metaphor of vessels I want to tell you: it is difficult
to set it on the water and let it go. Don't make the mistake and let it
sit on the dry until it is rotten. It is a venture to get out of your
dreams and into the real world.

Just lets do it.

--
As the Steve (the person without a last name, who is in charge of the
global marketing) has nice book suggestions, I recommend "The
Masterpiece" of Emile Zola. It is about a painter (who bears
biographical similarities with Paul Cezanne) who tries to paint his
masterpiece and never comes to finish it.





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[Sean Moss-Pultz]

I will not reply to comments like these in detail. You would not understand.

  -Sean



Marcus Bauer wrote:

> On Wed, 2008-07-30 at 13:37 +0800, Sean Moss-Pultz wrote:
>> On 7/29/08 Marcus Bauer wrote:
>>> On Mon, 2008-07-28 at 15:33 -0700, steve wrote:
>>>>> Of course!!! Every toolkit  is allowed.
>>>>>
>>>>> The whole point about FSO is to free people to pick their toolkit!
>>> The opposite is true. FSO forces you into ASU. It basically makes all
>>> work that has been put into OM2007.2 useless.
>>>
>>> Please stop telling these lies.
>> Marcus
>>
>> You do realize who you are talking to?
>
> This is a childish question.
>
>> This is person in charge of all
>> of marketing for Openmoko. If he says, "the point of something is..."
>> you should understand that he speaks for Openmoko.
>
> If he would be the pope, then I would understand that he speaks for the
> catholic church and when he says "the point of something is..." I would
> know he is infallible by definition.
>
> But if the marketing guy (not sales guy as he pointed out) makes wrong
> technical statements I have enough authority to correct them. (Simply go
> over to Wikipedia and check for the word meritocracy and its connection
> to open source.)
>
> And I allow myself to counter your question: Do you realize who *you*
> are talking to?
>
> I am part of your community and I have spent at least four full time
> months of development for YOUR system. And opposed to you I am not paid.
>
> If there is someone who should pay respect, how about you paying respect
> to me?
>
>
>> You can say what you
>> want about his ideas. But you have no basis whatsoever to say he's lieing.
>
> FSO has nothing to do with "freeing people to pick their toolkit".
> OM2007.2 offers the phonekit and eds (evolution data server).
>
> Both already allow for dbus abstraction and this whole argument is
> stale. OpenedHand (the authors of OM2007.2) knew what they were doing:
>
>         "OpenedHand is, IMHO, the most talented open source company in
>         the world."
>
> Those are your very own words Sean, picked from your website.
>
>> So some respect.
>
> I don't get your point here, Sean. Church-like respect is not what gets
> things done. Having dreams is great, but then comes the point where you
> need to wake up and deliver.
>
> OM2007.2 is there, just lets use and refine it.
> The Neo Freerunner is there, just lets use and refine it.
> Since November 2006 we hear: "just a few more months".
>
> There is no reason to wait for FSO and seeing how chaotic development
> has been the past one and a half years I rather doubt that this will
> ever be anything usable. It is a lot more important to get a community
> of developers in here and a community of VAR (value added resellers).
> And it is a lot more important to build up an ecosystem.
>
> FSO is a questionable approach made by people with no industry
> experience, fresh from university. I have to repeat that I would
> strongly advise any third party developer to stay away from it.
>
> Revive OM2007.2, spend time, energy and money for building an ecosystem
> and get something out that others can build on. *Now*. Not in winter
> 2008 which then will be probaly summer 2009. Let your pet projects
> FSO/ASU run in parallel and once they are there, the world will be
> happy.
>
> Do it like the ASUS eeePC. They didn't set out to change the world and
> to compete with the MacBook Air. They have a rudimentary Linux System on
> it and people love it. Many people even go on with the simple interface
> while others reinstall their favourite system.
>
> And yet ASUS started a revolution. Not because they follow their own
> vision, but because they let people dream their own dreams.
>
> Sean, on the one hand you talk about empty vessels and museums, on the
> other hand fail to realize that it is already there. OM2007.2. Created
> by the most talented open source company.
>
> Staying in your metaphor of vessels I want to tell you: it is difficult
> to set it on the water and let it go. Don't make the mistake and let it
> sit on the dry until it is rotten. It is a venture to get out of your
> dreams and into the real world.
>
> Just lets do it.
>
> --
> As the Steve (the person without a last name, who is in charge of the
> global marketing) has nice book suggestions, I recommend "The
> Masterpiece" of Emile Zola. It is about a painter (who bears
> biographical similarities with Paul Cezanne) who tries to paint his
> masterpiece and never comes to finish it.
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Openmoko community mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community

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[Marcus Bauer]

On Wed, 2008-07-30 at 16:07 +0800, Sean Moss-Pultz wrote:
>
>
> I will not reply to comments like these in detail. You would not understand.

Well, we can start calling each other names here - and basically you are
calling me retarded. That's fine with me, but next time do it off list.

As you are the CEO, I'll try to explain my motivation for my emails a
last time:

      * I have spent considerable amounts of time, doing unpaid
        development for Openmoko - namely tangoGPS.
      * I feel that the cooperation between Openmoko and its developer
        community can be vastly improved, based on the above experience
      * in the french 'silicon valley' (Sophia Antipolis) with 30.000
        employees and 1.300 companies there is a similar sentiment

If you think everything is perfect and I just don't and wont understand,
so be it.

Have a nice day anyway, and hopefully many many Neos will be produced

  - Marcus Bauer
  -- developer of tangoGPS


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[Sean Moss-Pultz]

On 7/30/08 Marcus Bauer wrote:

> On Wed, 2008-07-30 at 16:07 +0800, Sean Moss-Pultz wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > I will not reply to comments like these in detail. You would not
> understand.
>
> Well, we can start calling each other names here - and basically you
> are
> calling me retarded. That's fine with me, but next time do it off
> list.

This is not at all what I meant. I will reply to you privately.

   -Sean

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[Alex Kavanagh]

Marcus Bauer wrote, On 30/07/08 08:32:

[snip]
>
> But if the marketing guy (not sales guy as he pointed out) makes wrong
> technical statements I have enough authority to correct them. (Simply go
> over to Wikipedia and check for the word meritocracy and its connection
> to open source.)
>  
"Authority" - interesting use of the word.  By whose 'authority' do you
get to call someone a liar?  (Regardless of whether you think it is
true).  I have no 'authority' to email to this list - I just have the
freedom to, because this is an open list.  Of course, you have the
freedom to call somebody a liar, although it might be libel if it turns
out not to be true.
> And I allow myself to counter your question: Do you realize who *you*
> are talking to?
>  
Does this really matter?
> I am part of your community and I have spent at least four full time
> months of development for YOUR system. And opposed to you I am not paid.
>  
A choice you made, probably because you thought it would be cool to have
TangoGPS on the OpenMoko.  It *is* cool by the way; great app.

[snip other stuff]

>
> OM2007.2 is there, just lets use and refine it.
> The Neo Freerunner is there, just lets use and refine it.
> Since November 2006 we hear: "just a few more months".
>
> There is no reason to wait for FSO and seeing how chaotic development
> has been the past one and a half years I rather doubt that this will
> ever be anything usable. It is a lot more important to get a community
> of developers in here and a community of VAR (value added resellers).
> And it is a lot more important to build up an ecosystem.
>
> FSO is a questionable approach made by people with no industry
> experience, fresh from university. I have to repeat that I would
> strongly advise any third party developer to stay away from it.
>  

Why is it a questionable approach?  Because it isn't GMAE?  Because it
doesn't use e-d-s?

The statement 'people with no industry experience, fresh from
university'?  Why do you feel that is important?  Attack ASU/FSO not the
messengers who bring it.  Saying something is a bad idea because of
'who' someone is, or what (you believe) their experience is, is a poor
argument.  Attack the ideas not the person.  Fundamentally, what is
wrong with the ASU/FSO approach as an idea or implementation?

So, why not ASU/FSO?  I know that they use qtopia apps against GMAE
ones.  And it removes e-d-s from the picture to replace it by PIM.

Looking at the FSO stack at
http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Image:OpenmokoFramework08.png is similar
to the GMAE one at: http://www.gnome.org/mobile/ except for the explicit
d-bus separation layer and the four GUI toolkits in which to write apps.

In fact the key difference (on the surface) seems to be that you can
write in four different toolkits on FSO (whenever it appears - and that
could be the problem.)  I'm not at all clear on what the ASU software
stack looks like.  The GMAE stack looks like you can write GTK+ apps on
it.  How would qtopia or EFL apps be supported?

Alex.

PS I have no authority to question you.  Just the freedom to.  Feel free
to ignore me.


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[Aaron Sowry]

> This is not at all what I meant. I will reply to you privately.
>
>    -Sean
>  
...thank you!

*removes flak jacket*

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[Michele Renda]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Marcus Bauer wrote:
>       * I have spent considerable amounts of time, doing unpaid
>         development for Openmoko - namely tangoGPS.

This give you a lot of honor, and if until now I avoid to reply to you
was also for this fact.

>       * I feel that the cooperation between Openmoko and its developer
>         community can be vastly improved, based on the above experience
>       * in the french 'silicon valley' (Sophia Antipolis) with 30.000
>         employees and 1.300 companies there is a similar sentiment

You can not to speack also for around 30.000 persons.

> If you think everything is perfect and I just don't and wont understand,
> so be it.

Marcus the problem is this: Every person can have own ideas. I have
mine, you yours, openmoko their, etc etc.
When the ideas are different is important how to discuss about it.
Freerunner is nice because every person can apply his idea trasforming
it to code.

What you did, ultil now was only to make polemics about decision token
by openmoko, and to say they are liers. And this did me sad, because I
am sure you are a very good developer and you can trasform all you ideas
in wonderful code.

Making a lot of polemics, will trasform us in politician, not in
developer. So, if you feel, make your idea code, but please let Openmoko
free to follow their.

Have you a nice day

- - Michele Renda
- -- developer of nothing

>
> Have a nice day anyway, and hopefully many many Neos will be produced
>
>   - Marcus Bauer
>   -- developer of tangoGPS
>
>
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[David Pottage]

On Wed, July 30, 2008 9:07 am, Sean Moss-Pultz wrote:

> I will not reply to comments like these in detail. You would not
> understand.

Sean:

Ad homen attacks aside, you need to respond in public to Marcus's
substantive points. He is an important community developer, and he is
expressing real issues that are widely felt. Tango GPS is a killer
application for OpenMoko, and if we loose it, then we substantially
weaken the platform, you should think very carefully before burning
that bridge.

I don’t think it was helpful for him to insult you, I guess he was
angry, but regardless his points about getting a working platform now
are important. You want to build up a community around OpenMoko, from
which you hope will flow lots of useful applications. You where very
successful in doing that before the hardware was released, but now that
it has, and thousands of enthusiast have put down a months rent on a
unit of hardware there is widespread frustration.

None of us expected an iPhone like polished and fully integrated
software stack, but we did expect a developer friendly platform with
some basic functionality that would mostly work. Instead the software
distributions are forked 5 ways, and none of them work. I am sure I am
not the only person who is disinclined to put any effort into finding
or fixing the many bugs because I have no idea which distributions will
emerge from the mess.

You hope that the community to come up with lots of useful applets and
full applications, to run on the first open cell phone. For that to
happen most people will be 'scratching an itch' The problem is that
they will not chose to use an OpenMoko to scratch that itch unless they
are carrying it with them, which won't happen until basic phone
functionality is working, and most enthusiasts are carrying their
OpenMoko as their personal phone. The Wiki and Mailing lists are
absolutely brimming with ideas, many of which would be quick to code in
a scripting language, but none of this will happen until the basics are
there.

As Marcus says, the staff a OpenMoko need to put FSO/ASU aside for a
while at least and refocus on getting working phone functionality from
OM2007.2 as soon as possible. All the design docs are already there on
the Wiki and have been for 18 months, it just needs implementing. Once
the ecosystem has been started properly you can spend time if you must
on your blue sky projects with their clever design.

--
David Pottage

Error compiling committee.c To many arguments to function.



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[arne anka]

> Ad homen attacks aside, you need to respond in public to Marcus's
> substantive points.
> [as lot of the sensible remarks]

+1

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[Alex Kavanagh]

David Pottage wrote, On 30/07/08 11:07:
> None of us expected an iPhone like polished and fully integrated
> software stack, but we did expect a developer friendly platform with
> some basic functionality that would mostly work.
Strangely enough, I didn't.  Not having read the mailing list, looked at
the wiki.  I expected a h/w platform that mostly worked and software
that basically didn't.
>  Instead the software
> distributions are forked 5 ways, and none of them work.
That *is* the main problem.
>  I am sure I am
> not the only person who is disinclined to put any effort into finding
> or fixing the many bugs because I have no idea which distributions will
> emerge from the mess.
>  
That pretty much sums up my position.
> You hope that the community to come up with lots of useful applets and
> full applications, to run on the first open cell phone. For that to
> happen most people will be 'scratching an itch' The problem is that
> they will not chose to use an OpenMoko to scratch that itch unless they
> are carrying it with them, which won't happen until basic phone
> functionality is working, and most enthusiasts are carrying their
> OpenMoko as their personal phone.
I'm currently carrying it as my personal phone, but it will very quickly
become my secondary phone, until the basic phone stuff works.  I'll
still carry it though.
>  The Wiki and Mailing lists are
> absolutely brimming with ideas, many of which would be quick to code in
> a scripting language, but none of this will happen until the basics are
> there.
>
> As Marcus says, the staff a OpenMoko need to put FSO/ASU aside for a
> while at least and refocus on getting working phone functionality from
> OM2007.2 as soon as possible.
Maybe I've *completely* misunderstood something here, but I thought that
the ASU effort was to get an interim phone working asap using the qtopia
apps because they are better than the GMAE ones (is that just a
perception?).  i.e. all the work going into ASU *is* to get a functional
phone.

So my question remains:  why ASU and not OM2007 (GMAE)?

--
Alex.


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[Sean Moss-Pultz]

On 7/30/08 David Pottage wrote:

> On Wed, July 30, 2008 9:07 am, Sean Moss-Pultz wrote:
>
> > > I will not reply to comments like these in detail. You would not
> > > understand.
>
> Sean:
>
> Ad homen attacks aside, you need to respond in public to Marcus's
> substantive points. He is an important community developer, and he is
> expressing real issues that are widely felt. Tango GPS is a killer
> application for OpenMoko, and if we loose it, then we substantially
> weaken the platform, you should think very carefully before burning
> that bridge.

It was never my intention to burn bridges. I was only reacting to his
Steve's a liar post.


If you really want this public, here is what I said:

--
Marcus

Email can be a very poor medium to exchange words. You took my "do you
know who you're talking with" email the wrong way.

All I wanted to say is that Steve represents the ideas of this project.
So if he says something, even if it's technically not the reality of
codebase, you can't say he's lying. He knows the direction we're going.
So maybe he's starting to talk about this more publicly. Which should be
a good thing. Lying: That's a very strong accusation.

No personal disrespect was meant to you. I really like the work you did
on TangoGPS.

My apologies. Peace?

--

This particular list, over last few days, has just been too
emotionally-charged for my tastes. I'll be silent for a bit and catch up
reading new messages over the weekend when I fly again. Hopefully things
calm down by then.

   -Sean

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[Michele Renda]

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What to say... free software is done by open passions :)

And we deeply like it :)
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[Julien Cassignol]

On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 12:38 PM, John Lee <[hidden email]> wrote:

> since OM will stick with fso in the foreseeable future, I think port
> OM2007.2 app suites to fso is a logical move.  ogpsd is there based on
> gypsy, and it should be just another backend of tangogps.

Just so you know, the main goal of the Stable Hybrid Release (SHR :
http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/SHR) is to port applications from 2007.2
to FSO.

We have already ported GSM Panel, and we're currently building the
dialer. As soon as all of that stuff will be done, it should be usable
as is on FSO, or on our image which will, in the end, be either an
installation of the "new" frameworkd on old 2007.2, or some basic
packages to install on FSO.

--
Julien Cassignol

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[Michele Renda]

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Hi all

Finally I am near to the finish line, I think I missed linux world, but
in the end I made something that could be useful for someone:

I opened a project in launchpad:

http://launchpad.net/ogino-gtk

Until now this program is available only on .deb package, so to use it
you need Debian/Ubuntu.

I am waiting for my FR ( I know Pulter shipped me today :) to build the
IPK version.


If you want feel free to try it. The two package can be found on:

http://rubino.dyndns.org/

Until now there is only a known bug: when you change the application
language you need to close and to open another time the application.
I will try to fix this bug as soon as possible

I actually need translator for it. There are around 50 lines to be
translated (I suggest to use PoEdit).

Who want to join please contact me. Actually it is translated in 3
language: English, Italian, Romanian. Who know another language and want
to help me please contact me.


Who has some suggestion or found some bugs please reply to this email or
contact direct to me.


Best regards
Michele Renda

steve wrote:

> Of course!!! Every toolkit  is allowed.
>
> The whole point about FSO is to free people to pick their toolkit!
>
>  
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Michele Renda
> Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 9:59 AM
> To: List for Openmoko community discussion
> Subject: Re: Request for help: Would like community applications to show
> anddiscuss at LinuxWorld
>

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