PC/Linux sanity check for OD loading
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Michael Chinen
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Hi,
I just changed the OD system to use condition variables for checking the queue instead of sleep/polling. This should make the loading time of OD files slightly. I've tested on mac and this seems to be true. However, the mac uses pthreads and pc/linux use wx classes. Can someone try it out on PC/linux? I tried my best to make sure it'll compile. Loading three wavs at once that should be a good enough test for this change. Also, please check to make sure audacity exits completely on quit. Thanks, Michael ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Come build with us! The BlackBerry® Developer Conference in SF, CA is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9-12, 2009. Register now! http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconf _______________________________________________ audacity-devel mailing list [hidden email] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel |
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Al Dimond
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On Tuesday 06 October 2009 10:01:27 Michael Chinen wrote:
> Hi, > > I just changed the OD system to use condition variables for checking > the queue instead of sleep/polling. This should make the loading time > of OD files slightly. > I've tested on mac and this seems to be true. However, the mac uses > pthreads and pc/linux use wx classes. Can someone try it out on > PC/linux? I tried my best to make sure it'll compile. Loading three > wavs at once that should be a good enough test for this change. Also, > please check to make sure audacity exits completely on quit. > > Thanks, > > Michael > Err... do the files have to be of any particular length? I'm not really familiar with the OD system, but I tried to load three long files and my system hung very badly for 30 minutes, then audacity quit. I'll try three short files. And, to be sure, you just want me to bring up the import dialog, select three tracks, and hit OK, right? - Al ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Come build with us! The BlackBerry(R) Developer Conference in SF, CA is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9 - 12, 2009. Register now! http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconference _______________________________________________ audacity-devel mailing list [hidden email] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel |
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Al Dimond
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On Tuesday 06 October 2009 14:34:00 Al Dimond wrote:
> On Tuesday 06 October 2009 10:01:27 Michael Chinen wrote: > > Hi, > > > > I just changed the OD system to use condition variables for checking > > the queue instead of sleep/polling. This should make the loading time > > of OD files slightly. > > I've tested on mac and this seems to be true. However, the mac uses > > pthreads and pc/linux use wx classes. Can someone try it out on > > PC/linux? I tried my best to make sure it'll compile. Loading three > > wavs at once that should be a good enough test for this change. Also, > > please check to make sure audacity exits completely on quit. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Michael > > Err... do the files have to be of any particular length? I'm not really > familiar with the OD system, but I tried to load three long files and my > system hung very badly for 30 minutes, then audacity quit. > > I'll try three short files. And, to be sure, you just want me to bring up > the import dialog, select three tracks, and hit OK, right? > > - Al The short files (two were 30s, one was about a minute long) didn't work any better. I killed it after a minute, but at that point top put audacity's memory usage at 90%. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Come build with us! The BlackBerry(R) Developer Conference in SF, CA is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9 - 12, 2009. Register now! http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconference _______________________________________________ audacity-devel mailing list [hidden email] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel |
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Al Dimond
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On Tuesday 06 October 2009 14:45:05 Al Dimond wrote:
> On Tuesday 06 October 2009 14:34:00 Al Dimond wrote: > > On Tuesday 06 October 2009 10:01:27 Michael Chinen wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > > > I just changed the OD system to use condition variables for checking > > > the queue instead of sleep/polling. This should make the loading time > > > of OD files slightly. > > > I've tested on mac and this seems to be true. However, the mac uses > > > pthreads and pc/linux use wx classes. Can someone try it out on > > > PC/linux? I tried my best to make sure it'll compile. Loading three > > > wavs at once that should be a good enough test for this change. Also, > > > please check to make sure audacity exits completely on quit. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Michael > > > > Err... do the files have to be of any particular length? I'm not really > > familiar with the OD system, but I tried to load three long files and my > > system hung very badly for 30 minutes, then audacity quit. > > > > I'll try three short files. And, to be sure, you just want me to bring > > up the import dialog, select three tracks, and hit OK, right? > > > > - Al > > The short files (two were 30s, one was about a minute long) didn't work any > better. I killed it after a minute, but at that point top put audacity's > memory usage at 90%. Loading the files one-at-a-time works, though, and I get messages in the bottom toolbar about on-demand waveform calculation, "Import complete. Running an on-demand waveform calculation. 100% complete." These messages come and go during and even after playback. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Come build with us! The BlackBerry(R) Developer Conference in SF, CA is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9 - 12, 2009. Register now! http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconference _______________________________________________ audacity-devel mailing list [hidden email] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel |
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Michael Chinen
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On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 10:54 PM, Al Dimond
<[hidden email]> wrote: > On Tuesday 06 October 2009 14:45:05 Al Dimond wrote: >> On Tuesday 06 October 2009 14:34:00 Al Dimond wrote: >> > On Tuesday 06 October 2009 10:01:27 Michael Chinen wrote: >> > > Hi, >> > > >> > > I just changed the OD system to use condition variables for checking >> > > the queue instead of sleep/polling. This should make the loading time >> > > of OD files slightly. >> > > I've tested on mac and this seems to be true. However, the mac uses >> > > pthreads and pc/linux use wx classes. Can someone try it out on >> > > PC/linux? I tried my best to make sure it'll compile. Loading three >> > > wavs at once that should be a good enough test for this change. Also, >> > > please check to make sure audacity exits completely on quit. >> > > >> > > Thanks, >> > > >> > > Michael >> > >> > Err... do the files have to be of any particular length? I'm not really >> > familiar with the OD system, but I tried to load three long files and my >> > system hung very badly for 30 minutes, then audacity quit. >> > >> > I'll try three short files. And, to be sure, you just want me to bring >> > up the import dialog, select three tracks, and hit OK, right? >> > >> > - Al >> >> The short files (two were 30s, one was about a minute long) didn't work any >> better. I killed it after a minute, but at that point top put audacity's >> memory usage at 90%. > > Loading the files one-at-a-time works, though, and I get messages in the bottom > toolbar about on-demand waveform calculation, "Import complete. Running an > on-demand waveform calculation. 100% complete." These messages come and go > during and even after playback. another test, I've just checked in something that might fix it. The problem seems to be that the wait behavior for condition variables seems to be quite different for wx and pthread. I'm waiting for feedback on the wx-users list right now to figure out what the best solution is. Sorry all for the break, and if its not fixed soon (a day and a half,) I'll revert it back to the old code. Michael > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Come build with us! The BlackBerry(R) Developer Conference in SF, CA is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9 - 12, 2009. Register now! http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconference _______________________________________________ audacity-devel mailing list [hidden email] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel |
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Michael Chinen
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On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 1:15 AM, Michael Chinen <[hidden email]> wrote:
> On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 10:54 PM, Al Dimond > <[hidden email]> wrote: >> On Tuesday 06 October 2009 14:45:05 Al Dimond wrote: >>> On Tuesday 06 October 2009 14:34:00 Al Dimond wrote: >>> > On Tuesday 06 October 2009 10:01:27 Michael Chinen wrote: >>> > > Hi, >>> > > >>> > > I just changed the OD system to use condition variables for checking >>> > > the queue instead of sleep/polling. This should make the loading time >>> > > of OD files slightly. >>> > > I've tested on mac and this seems to be true. However, the mac uses >>> > > pthreads and pc/linux use wx classes. Can someone try it out on >>> > > PC/linux? I tried my best to make sure it'll compile. Loading three >>> > > wavs at once that should be a good enough test for this change. Also, >>> > > please check to make sure audacity exits completely on quit. >>> > > >>> > > Thanks, >>> > > >>> > > Michael >>> > >>> > Err... do the files have to be of any particular length? I'm not really >>> > familiar with the OD system, but I tried to load three long files and my >>> > system hung very badly for 30 minutes, then audacity quit. Sorry, I forgot to mention the files should be at least 30 seconds @44.1kHz long, otherwise the old method of aliased block files is used. Sorry you had to wait for 30 minutes. If Audacity hangs for more than 30 seconds when you load files this way, you should force quit and let me know. Thanks, Michael >>> > >>> > I'll try three short files. And, to be sure, you just want me to bring >>> > up the import dialog, select three tracks, and hit OK, right? >>> > >>> > - Al >>> >>> The short files (two were 30s, one was about a minute long) didn't work any >>> better. I killed it after a minute, but at that point top put audacity's >>> memory usage at 90%. >> >> Loading the files one-at-a-time works, though, and I get messages in the bottom >> toolbar about on-demand waveform calculation, "Import complete. Running an >> on-demand waveform calculation. 100% complete." These messages come and go >> during and even after playback. > Thanks for checking Al. If you or anyone else would like to give it > another test, I've just checked in something that might fix it. > The problem seems to be that the wait behavior for condition variables > seems to be quite different for wx and pthread. I'm waiting for > feedback on the wx-users list right now to figure out what the best > solution is. > Sorry all for the break, and if its not fixed soon (a day and a half,) > I'll revert it back to the old code. > > Michael > > > >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Come build with us! The BlackBerry(R) Developer Conference in SF, CA is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9 - 12, 2009. Register now! http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconference _______________________________________________ audacity-devel mailing list [hidden email] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel |
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Al Dimond
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On Tuesday 06 October 2009 17:24:03 Michael Chinen wrote:
> Sorry, I forgot to mention the files should be at least 30 seconds > @44.1kHz long, otherwise the old method of aliased block files is > used. Sorry you had to wait for 30 minutes. If Audacity hangs for > more than 30 seconds when you load files this way, you should force > quit and let me know. Thanks, > > Michael > No prob... better it hang my computer than someone that's doing something other than testing. After about 10 minutes it was hung so badly that pretty much nothing was responding (the taskbar clock was stuck, clicking on stuff didn't work, and I couldn't even ssh into the box)... which I should probably blame on X, KDE, and the Linux scheduler. > > Thanks for checking Al. If you or anyone else would like to give it > > another test, I've just checked in something that might fix it. > > The problem seems to be that the wait behavior for condition variables > > seems to be quite different for wx and pthread. I'm waiting for > > feedback on the wx-users list right now to figure out what the best > > solution is. > > Sorry all for the break, and if its not fixed soon (a day and a half,) > > I'll revert it back to the old code. > > > > Michael > This time it worked perfectly, with three stereo .wavs, each a little more than a minute long. - Al ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Come build with us! The BlackBerry(R) Developer Conference in SF, CA is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9 - 12, 2009. Register now! http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconference _______________________________________________ audacity-devel mailing list [hidden email] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel |
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Gale (Audacity Team)
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| From Al Dimond <[hidden email]> | Tue, 6 Oct 2009 17:46:41 -0600 | Subject: [Audacity-devel] PC/Linux sanity check for OD loading > On Tuesday 06 October 2009 17:24:03 Michael Chinen wrote: > > Sorry, I forgot to mention the files should be at least 30 seconds > > @44.1kHz long, otherwise the old method of aliased block files is > > used. Sorry you had to wait for 30 minutes. If Audacity hangs for > > more than 30 seconds when you load files this way, you should force > > quit and let me know. Thanks, > > > > > Thanks for checking Al. If you or anyone else would like to give it > > > another test, I've just checked in something that might fix it. > > > The problem seems to be that the wait behavior for condition variables > > > seems to be quite different for wx and pthread. I'm waiting for > > > feedback on the wx-users list right now to figure out what the best > > > solution is. > > > Sorry all for the break, and if its not fixed soon (a day and a half,) > > > I'll revert it back to the old code. > > > > > > Michael > > > > This time it worked perfectly, with three stereo .wavs, each a little more > than a minute long. Hi Michael I tested it just now on Win XP, after updating to the latest 1.31 version of ODManager.cpp. I tried with three 5-minute 44100 Hz WAVs, dragged in together, then closed the project and dragged them in individually instead. There is no real hang or excessive CPU use in terms of Audacity being unresponsive, but the waveform calculation never completes after import. At best (when importing a single file), I got the first minute calculated. To view the waveform, I had to amplify it. Note this always shows the required "Amplification (dB)" as 0.0 irrespective of the actual volume of the track, and doesn't actually apply any amplification. Amplification seems correct if redone (I assume this is all expected given no calculation was done). It isn't possible here to quit Audacity without force-quitting, once an OD file has been imported. I *can* clear to an empty project by unchecking "Closing last window quits... " in Preferences. The Status Bar message correctly reflects the % of waveform that has been calculated (disappearing after Amplify has completed the calculation). The quoted number of on-demand waveform calculations seems to be more than one per track after your change. One five-minute track reported 7 calculations when I imported it on its own. After clearing to an new project and importing a similar file, there were only 2 calculations going on for that file. Can you explain a bit more about that, because the Manual would be affected by this. NB I have built into an empty directory, so am confident of the result. Gale ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Come build with us! The BlackBerry(R) Developer Conference in SF, CA is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9 - 12, 2009. Register now! http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconference _______________________________________________ audacity-devel mailing list [hidden email] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel |
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Michael Chinen
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On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 6:34 AM, Gale Andrews <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > | From Al Dimond <[hidden email]> > | Tue, 6 Oct 2009 17:46:41 -0600 > | Subject: [Audacity-devel] PC/Linux sanity check for OD loading >> On Tuesday 06 October 2009 17:24:03 Michael Chinen wrote: >> > Sorry, I forgot to mention the files should be at least 30 seconds >> > @44.1kHz long, otherwise the old method of aliased block files is >> > used. Sorry you had to wait for 30 minutes. If Audacity hangs for >> > more than 30 seconds when you load files this way, you should force >> > quit and let me know. Thanks, >> > >> > > Thanks for checking Al. If you or anyone else would like to give it >> > > another test, I've just checked in something that might fix it. >> > > The problem seems to be that the wait behavior for condition variables >> > > seems to be quite different for wx and pthread. I'm waiting for >> > > feedback on the wx-users list right now to figure out what the best >> > > solution is. >> > > Sorry all for the break, and if its not fixed soon (a day and a half,) >> > > I'll revert it back to the old code. >> > > >> > > Michael >> > >> >> This time it worked perfectly, with three stereo .wavs, each a little more >> than a minute long. > > Hi Michael > > I tested it just now on Win XP, after updating to the latest > 1.31 version of ODManager.cpp. I tried with three 5-minute > 44100 Hz WAVs, dragged in together, then closed the > project and dragged them in individually instead. > > There is no real hang or excessive CPU use in terms of > Audacity being unresponsive, but the waveform calculation > never completes after import. At best (when importing a > single file), I got the first minute calculated. > > To view the waveform, I had to amplify it. Note this always > shows the required "Amplification (dB)" as 0.0 irrespective > of the actual volume of the track, and doesn't actually apply > any amplification. Amplification seems correct if redone > (I assume this is all expected given no calculation was done). > > It isn't possible here to quit Audacity without force-quitting, > once an OD file has been imported. I *can* clear to an > empty project by unchecking "Closing last window quits... " > in Preferences. > > The Status Bar message correctly reflects the % of waveform > that has been calculated (disappearing after Amplify has > completed the calculation). > > The quoted number of on-demand waveform calculations > seems to be more than one per track after your change. One > five-minute track reported 7 calculations when I imported it > on its own. After clearing to an new project and importing a > similar file, there were only 2 calculations going on for that > file. Can you explain a bit more about that, because the Manual > would be affected by this. > > NB I have built into an empty directory, so am confident of the > result. would verify it still works there, that would be great. Thanks, Michael > > > > Gale > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Come build with us! The BlackBerry(R) Developer Conference in SF, CA > is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your > developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay > ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9 - 12, 2009. Register now! > http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconference > _______________________________________________ > audacity-devel mailing list > [hidden email] > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Come build with us! The BlackBerry(R) Developer Conference in SF, CA is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9 - 12, 2009. Register now! http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconference _______________________________________________ audacity-devel mailing list [hidden email] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel |
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Al Dimond
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On Wednesday 07 October 2009 09:52:35 Michael Chinen wrote:
> > > > Hi Michael > > > > I tested it just now on Win XP, after updating to the latest > > 1.31 version of ODManager.cpp. I tried with three 5-minute > > 44100 Hz WAVs, dragged in together, then closed the > > project and dragged them in individually instead. > > > > There is no real hang or excessive CPU use in terms of > > Audacity being unresponsive, but the waveform calculation > > never completes after import. At best (when importing a > > single file), I got the first minute calculated. > > > > To view the waveform, I had to amplify it. Note this always > > shows the required "Amplification (dB)" as 0.0 irrespective > > of the actual volume of the track, and doesn't actually apply > > any amplification. Amplification seems correct if redone > > (I assume this is all expected given no calculation was done). > > > > It isn't possible here to quit Audacity without force-quitting, > > once an OD file has been imported. I *can* clear to an > > empty project by unchecking "Closing last window quits... " > > in Preferences. > > > > The Status Bar message correctly reflects the % of waveform > > that has been calculated (disappearing after Amplify has > > completed the calculation). > > > > The quoted number of on-demand waveform calculations > > seems to be more than one per track after your change. One > > five-minute track reported 7 calculations when I imported it > > on its own. After clearing to an new project and importing a > > similar file, there were only 2 calculations going on for that > > file. Can you explain a bit more about that, because the Manual > > would be affected by this. > > > > NB I have built into an empty directory, so am confident of the > > result. > > Hi Gale, could you please try it again. Also if Al or another linuxer > would verify it still works there, that would be great. Still works here on Linux. I don't exactly know what it was reporting in terms of waveform calculations completing or how many. I should probably read up on exactly what all that stuff does. Using ~6 minute-long tracks this time I saw the waveforms build up in the track panel, quickly enough that I wouldn't have been able to try doing anything before that finished. During playback, though, there still were a few messages saying that waveform calculation was 33%, then 100% complete. - Al > > Thanks, > > Michael > > > Gale > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Come build with us! The BlackBerry(R) Developer Conference in SF, CA is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9 - 12, 2009. Register now! http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconference _______________________________________________ audacity-devel mailing list [hidden email] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel |
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Gale (Audacity Team)
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In reply to this post
by Michael Chinen
| From Michael Chinen <[hidden email]> | Wed, 7 Oct 2009 17:52:35 +0200 | Subject: [Audacity-devel] PC/Linux sanity check for OD loading > On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 6:34 AM, Gale Andrews <[hidden email]> wrote: > > > > | From Al Dimond <[hidden email]> > > | Tue, 6 Oct 2009 17:46:41 -0600 > > | Subject: [Audacity-devel] PC/Linux sanity check for OD loading > >> On Tuesday 06 October 2009 17:24:03 Michael Chinen wrote: > >> > Sorry, I forgot to mention the files should be at least 30 seconds > >> > @44.1kHz long, otherwise the old method of aliased block files is > >> > used. Sorry you had to wait for 30 minutes. If Audacity hangs for > >> > more than 30 seconds when you load files this way, you should force > >> > quit and let me know. Thanks, > >> > > >> > > Thanks for checking Al. If you or anyone else would like to give it > >> > > another test, I've just checked in something that might fix it. > >> > > The problem seems to be that the wait behavior for condition variables > >> > > seems to be quite different for wx and pthread. I'm waiting for > >> > > feedback on the wx-users list right now to figure out what the best > >> > > solution is. > >> > > Sorry all for the break, and if its not fixed soon (a day and a half,) > >> > > I'll revert it back to the old code. > >> > > > >> > > Michael > >> > > >> > >> This time it worked perfectly, with three stereo .wavs, each a little more > >> than a minute long. > > > > Hi Michael > > > > I tested it just now on Win XP, after updating to the latest > > 1.31 version of ODManager.cpp. I tried with three 5-minute > > 44100 Hz WAVs, dragged in together, then closed the > > project and dragged them in individually instead. > > > > There is no real hang or excessive CPU use in terms of > > Audacity being unresponsive, but the waveform calculation > > never completes after import. At best (when importing a > > single file), I got the first minute calculated. > > > > To view the waveform, I had to amplify it. Note this always > > shows the required "Amplification (dB)" as 0.0 irrespective > > of the actual volume of the track, and doesn't actually apply > > any amplification. Amplification seems correct if redone > > (I assume this is all expected given no calculation was done). > > > > It isn't possible here to quit Audacity without force-quitting, > > once an OD file has been imported. I *can* clear to an > > empty project by unchecking "Closing last window quits... " > > in Preferences. > > > > The Status Bar message correctly reflects the % of waveform > > that has been calculated (disappearing after Amplify has > > completed the calculation). > > > > The quoted number of on-demand waveform calculations > > seems to be more than one per track after your change. One > > five-minute track reported 7 calculations when I imported it > > on its own. After clearing to an new project and importing a > > similar file, there were only 2 calculations going on for that > > file. Can you explain a bit more about that, because the Manual > > would be affected by this. > > > > NB I have built into an empty directory, so am confident of the > > result. > > Hi Gale, could you please try it again. Also if Al or another linuxer > would verify it still works there, that would be great. The waveforms now complete on Win XP, and I can exit Audacity OK. As to speed improvements, I tested simultaneously importing two WAV files lasting an hour each. On the basis of three tests in 1.3.9 Release and three in 1.3.10, the average time to complete was 76 seconds in 1.3.9 Release and 62 seconds in 1.3.10. Although the number of calculations is now the same as the number of tracks imported, the overall calculation given in the Status Bar is dividing the result by the number of tracks. So if you import four files, the waveforms complete when the message says "Overall 25% complete". 1.3.9 has the same issue. A problem new to 1.3.10 is that although you get the "Calculating waveform 100% complete" message on mouseover, you can never get rid of the "progress" message in the status bar e.g. "Import complete. Running four on-demand waveform calculations. 25% complete." So if after completion you select a region and amplify it, as soon as there is no more mouse activity the progress message returns. Can we fix these two issues? Thanks Gale ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Come build with us! The BlackBerry(R) Developer Conference in SF, CA is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9 - 12, 2009. Register now! http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconference _______________________________________________ audacity-devel mailing list [hidden email] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel |
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Michael Chinen
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On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 8:53 PM, Gale Andrews <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > | From Michael Chinen <[hidden email]> > | Wed, 7 Oct 2009 17:52:35 +0200 > | Subject: [Audacity-devel] PC/Linux sanity check for OD loading >> On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 6:34 AM, Gale Andrews <[hidden email]> wrote: >> > >> > | From Al Dimond <[hidden email]> >> > | Tue, 6 Oct 2009 17:46:41 -0600 >> > | Subject: [Audacity-devel] PC/Linux sanity check for OD loading >> >> On Tuesday 06 October 2009 17:24:03 Michael Chinen wrote: >> >> > Sorry, I forgot to mention the files should be at least 30 seconds >> >> > @44.1kHz long, otherwise the old method of aliased block files is >> >> > used. Sorry you had to wait for 30 minutes. If Audacity hangs for >> >> > more than 30 seconds when you load files this way, you should force >> >> > quit and let me know. Thanks, >> >> > >> >> > > Thanks for checking Al. If you or anyone else would like to give it >> >> > > another test, I've just checked in something that might fix it. >> >> > > The problem seems to be that the wait behavior for condition variables >> >> > > seems to be quite different for wx and pthread. I'm waiting for >> >> > > feedback on the wx-users list right now to figure out what the best >> >> > > solution is. >> >> > > Sorry all for the break, and if its not fixed soon (a day and a half,) >> >> > > I'll revert it back to the old code. >> >> > > >> >> > > Michael >> >> > >> >> >> >> This time it worked perfectly, with three stereo .wavs, each a little more >> >> than a minute long. >> > >> > Hi Michael >> > >> > I tested it just now on Win XP, after updating to the latest >> > 1.31 version of ODManager.cpp. I tried with three 5-minute >> > 44100 Hz WAVs, dragged in together, then closed the >> > project and dragged them in individually instead. >> > >> > There is no real hang or excessive CPU use in terms of >> > Audacity being unresponsive, but the waveform calculation >> > never completes after import. At best (when importing a >> > single file), I got the first minute calculated. >> > >> > To view the waveform, I had to amplify it. Note this always >> > shows the required "Amplification (dB)" as 0.0 irrespective >> > of the actual volume of the track, and doesn't actually apply >> > any amplification. Amplification seems correct if redone >> > (I assume this is all expected given no calculation was done). >> > >> > It isn't possible here to quit Audacity without force-quitting, >> > once an OD file has been imported. I *can* clear to an >> > empty project by unchecking "Closing last window quits... " >> > in Preferences. >> > >> > The Status Bar message correctly reflects the % of waveform >> > that has been calculated (disappearing after Amplify has >> > completed the calculation). >> > >> > The quoted number of on-demand waveform calculations >> > seems to be more than one per track after your change. One >> > five-minute track reported 7 calculations when I imported it >> > on its own. After clearing to an new project and importing a >> > similar file, there were only 2 calculations going on for that >> > file. Can you explain a bit more about that, because the Manual >> > would be affected by this. >> > >> > NB I have built into an empty directory, so am confident of the >> > result. >> >> Hi Gale, could you please try it again. Also if Al or another linuxer >> would verify it still works there, that would be great. > > The waveforms now complete on Win XP, and I can exit Audacity OK. > > As to speed improvements, I tested simultaneously importing two WAV > files lasting an hour each. On the basis of three tests in 1.3.9 Release > and three in 1.3.10, the average time to complete was 76 seconds in > 1.3.9 Release and 62 seconds in 1.3.10. > > Although the number of calculations is now the same as the number of > tracks imported, the overall calculation given in the Status Bar is > dividing the result by the number of tracks. So if you import four files, > the waveforms complete when the message says "Overall 25% complete". > 1.3.9 has the same issue. > > A problem new to 1.3.10 is that although you get the "Calculating > waveform 100% complete" message on mouseover, you can never get > rid of the "progress" message in the status bar e.g. > > "Import complete. Running four on-demand waveform calculations. > 25% complete." > > So if after completion you select a region and amplify it, as soon > as there is no more mouse activity the progress message returns. > Can we fix these two issues? something looks fishy. Michael > > > Thanks > > > Gale > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Come build with us! The BlackBerry(R) Developer Conference in SF, CA > is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your > developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay > ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9 - 12, 2009. Register now! > http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconference > _______________________________________________ > audacity-devel mailing list > [hidden email] > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Come build with us! The BlackBerry(R) Developer Conference in SF, CA is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9 - 12, 2009. Register now! http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconference _______________________________________________ audacity-devel mailing list [hidden email] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel |
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David Bailes-2
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On Thu, Oct 8, 2009 at 12:41 AM, Michael Chinen <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Good catch. I think now I've patched these two up. Let me know if > something looks fishy :-) David. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Come build with us! The BlackBerry(R) Developer Conference in SF, CA is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9 - 12, 2009. Register now! http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconference _______________________________________________ audacity-devel mailing list [hidden email] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel |
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Gale (Audacity Team)
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In reply to this post
by Michael Chinen
| From Michael Chinen <[hidden email]> | Thu, 8 Oct 2009 01:41:23 +0200 | Subject: [Audacity-devel] PC/Linux sanity check for OD loading > On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 8:53 PM, Gale Andrews <[hidden email]> wrote: > > > > | From Michael Chinen <[hidden email]> > > | Wed, 7 Oct 2009 17:52:35 +0200 > > | Subject: [Audacity-devel] PC/Linux sanity check for OD loading > >> On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 6:34 AM, Gale Andrews <[hidden email]> wrote: > >> > > >> > | From Al Dimond <[hidden email]> > >> > | Tue, 6 Oct 2009 17:46:41 -0600 > >> > | Subject: [Audacity-devel] PC/Linux sanity check for OD loading > >> >> On Tuesday 06 October 2009 17:24:03 Michael Chinen wrote: > >> >> > Sorry, I forgot to mention the files should be at least 30 seconds > >> >> > @44.1kHz long, otherwise the old method of aliased block files is > >> >> > used. Sorry you had to wait for 30 minutes. If Audacity hangs for > >> >> > more than 30 seconds when you load files this way, you should force > >> >> > quit and let me know. Thanks, > >> >> > > >> >> > > Thanks for checking Al. If you or anyone else would like to give it > >> >> > > another test, I've just checked in something that might fix it. > >> >> > > The problem seems to be that the wait behavior for condition variables > >> >> > > seems to be quite different for wx and pthread. I'm waiting for > >> >> > > feedback on the wx-users list right now to figure out what the best > >> >> > > solution is. > >> >> > > Sorry all for the break, and if its not fixed soon (a day and a half,) > >> >> > > I'll revert it back to the old code. > >> >> > > > >> >> > > Michael > >> >> > > >> >> > >> >> This time it worked perfectly, with three stereo .wavs, each a little more > >> >> than a minute long. > >> > > >> > Hi Michael > >> > > >> > I tested it just now on Win XP, after updating to the latest > >> > 1.31 version of ODManager.cpp. I tried with three 5-minute > >> > 44100 Hz WAVs, dragged in together, then closed the > >> > project and dragged them in individually instead. > >> > > >> > There is no real hang or excessive CPU use in terms of > >> > Audacity being unresponsive, but the waveform calculation > >> > never completes after import. At best (when importing a > >> > single file), I got the first minute calculated. > >> > > >> > To view the waveform, I had to amplify it. Note this always > >> > shows the required "Amplification (dB)" as 0.0 irrespective > >> > of the actual volume of the track, and doesn't actually apply > >> > any amplification. Amplification seems correct if redone > >> > (I assume this is all expected given no calculation was done). > >> > > >> > It isn't possible here to quit Audacity without force-quitting, > >> > once an OD file has been imported. I *can* clear to an > >> > empty project by unchecking "Closing last window quits... " > >> > in Preferences. > >> > > >> > The Status Bar message correctly reflects the % of waveform > >> > that has been calculated (disappearing after Amplify has > >> > completed the calculation). > >> > > >> > The quoted number of on-demand waveform calculations > >> > seems to be more than one per track after your change. One > >> > five-minute track reported 7 calculations when I imported it > >> > on its own. After clearing to an new project and importing a > >> > similar file, there were only 2 calculations going on for that > >> > file. Can you explain a bit more about that, because the Manual > >> > would be affected by this. > >> > > >> > NB I have built into an empty directory, so am confident of the > >> > result. > >> > >> Hi Gale, could you please try it again. Also if Al or another linuxer > >> would verify it still works there, that would be great. > > > > The waveforms now complete on Win XP, and I can exit Audacity OK. > > > > As to speed improvements, I tested simultaneously importing two WAV > > files lasting an hour each. On the basis of three tests in 1.3.9 Release > > and three in 1.3.10, the average time to complete was 76 seconds in > > 1.3.9 Release and 62 seconds in 1.3.10. > > > > Although the number of calculations is now the same as the number of > > tracks imported, the overall calculation given in the Status Bar is > > dividing the result by the number of tracks. So if you import four files, > > the waveforms complete when the message says "Overall 25% complete". > > 1.3.9 has the same issue. > > > > A problem new to 1.3.10 is that although you get the "Calculating > > waveform 100% complete" message on mouseover, you can never get > > rid of the "progress" message in the status bar e.g. > > > > "Import complete. Running four on-demand waveform calculations. > > 25% complete." > > > > So if after completion you select a region and amplify it, as soon > > as there is no more mouse activity the progress message returns. > > Can we fix these two issues? > > > Good catch. I think now I've patched these two up. Let me know if > something looks fishy. On Windows XP I'm still only getting "on-demand import complete" as the final message (which disappears for good once you move the mouse) in about 10% of cases. This is what you want to happen isn't it? I'm not sure what David meant to say in his comment. In the other 90% of cases I still get left with "Import complete. Running an on-demand waveform calculation. 100% complete" which returns as soon as there is no mouse activity. I cannot find any pattern with number/length of files imported, whether imported simultaneously or not, whether clicked in track or not that makes this happen for sure. All I can say is that: * "on-demand import complete" does subliminally appear before being replaced with "Import complete..." * If "Import complete" gets stuck in the Status Bar, importing a further individual OD file will "usually" get rid of it and replace it with "on-demand import complete". A pedantic comment... * We should capitalise the "o" of "on" in "on-demand import complete". * There is a little bit of wooliness about the meaning of "import". It means both the progress dialogue part the user will never see with short files (after which the Status Bar says "Import complete. Calculating waveform..."); plus completion of the entire process of the import and calculation. Unless you were following the Status Bar progress it would be possible to wonder when you see the message "on-demand import complete" if the calculation had stalled. Maybe "On-demand import and calculation complete" is a mouthful, but more accurate. Gale ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Come build with us! The BlackBerry(R) Developer Conference in SF, CA is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9 - 12, 2009. Register now! http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconference _______________________________________________ audacity-devel mailing list [hidden email] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel |
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Michael Chinen
|
On Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 3:31 AM, Gale Andrews <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > | From Michael Chinen <[hidden email]> > | Thu, 8 Oct 2009 01:41:23 +0200 > | Subject: [Audacity-devel] PC/Linux sanity check for OD loading >> On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 8:53 PM, Gale Andrews <[hidden email]> wrote: >> > >> > | From Michael Chinen <[hidden email]> >> > | Wed, 7 Oct 2009 17:52:35 +0200 >> > | Subject: [Audacity-devel] PC/Linux sanity check for OD loading >> >> On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 6:34 AM, Gale Andrews <[hidden email]> wrote: >> >> > >> >> > | From Al Dimond <[hidden email]> >> >> > | Tue, 6 Oct 2009 17:46:41 -0600 >> >> > | Subject: [Audacity-devel] PC/Linux sanity check for OD loading >> >> >> On Tuesday 06 October 2009 17:24:03 Michael Chinen wrote: >> >> >> > Sorry, I forgot to mention the files should be at least 30 seconds >> >> >> > @44.1kHz long, otherwise the old method of aliased block files is >> >> >> > used. Sorry you had to wait for 30 minutes. If Audacity hangs for >> >> >> > more than 30 seconds when you load files this way, you should force >> >> >> > quit and let me know. Thanks, >> >> >> > >> >> >> > > Thanks for checking Al. If you or anyone else would like to give it >> >> >> > > another test, I've just checked in something that might fix it. >> >> >> > > The problem seems to be that the wait behavior for condition variables >> >> >> > > seems to be quite different for wx and pthread. I'm waiting for >> >> >> > > feedback on the wx-users list right now to figure out what the best >> >> >> > > solution is. >> >> >> > > Sorry all for the break, and if its not fixed soon (a day and a half,) >> >> >> > > I'll revert it back to the old code. >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > Michael >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> This time it worked perfectly, with three stereo .wavs, each a little more >> >> >> than a minute long. >> >> > >> >> > Hi Michael >> >> > >> >> > I tested it just now on Win XP, after updating to the latest >> >> > 1.31 version of ODManager.cpp. I tried with three 5-minute >> >> > 44100 Hz WAVs, dragged in together, then closed the >> >> > project and dragged them in individually instead. >> >> > >> >> > There is no real hang or excessive CPU use in terms of >> >> > Audacity being unresponsive, but the waveform calculation >> >> > never completes after import. At best (when importing a >> >> > single file), I got the first minute calculated. >> >> > >> >> > To view the waveform, I had to amplify it. Note this always >> >> > shows the required "Amplification (dB)" as 0.0 irrespective >> >> > of the actual volume of the track, and doesn't actually apply >> >> > any amplification. Amplification seems correct if redone >> >> > (I assume this is all expected given no calculation was done). >> >> > >> >> > It isn't possible here to quit Audacity without force-quitting, >> >> > once an OD file has been imported. I *can* clear to an >> >> > empty project by unchecking "Closing last window quits... " >> >> > in Preferences. >> >> > >> >> > The Status Bar message correctly reflects the % of waveform >> >> > that has been calculated (disappearing after Amplify has >> >> > completed the calculation). >> >> > >> >> > The quoted number of on-demand waveform calculations >> >> > seems to be more than one per track after your change. One >> >> > five-minute track reported 7 calculations when I imported it >> >> > on its own. After clearing to an new project and importing a >> >> > similar file, there were only 2 calculations going on for that >> >> > file. Can you explain a bit more about that, because the Manual >> >> > would be affected by this. >> >> > >> >> > NB I have built into an empty directory, so am confident of the >> >> > result. >> >> >> >> Hi Gale, could you please try it again. Also if Al or another linuxer >> >> would verify it still works there, that would be great. >> > >> > The waveforms now complete on Win XP, and I can exit Audacity OK. >> > >> > As to speed improvements, I tested simultaneously importing two WAV >> > files lasting an hour each. On the basis of three tests in 1.3.9 Release >> > and three in 1.3.10, the average time to complete was 76 seconds in >> > 1.3.9 Release and 62 seconds in 1.3.10. >> > >> > Although the number of calculations is now the same as the number of >> > tracks imported, the overall calculation given in the Status Bar is >> > dividing the result by the number of tracks. So if you import four files, >> > the waveforms complete when the message says "Overall 25% complete". >> > 1.3.9 has the same issue. >> > >> > A problem new to 1.3.10 is that although you get the "Calculating >> > waveform 100% complete" message on mouseover, you can never get >> > rid of the "progress" message in the status bar e.g. >> > >> > "Import complete. Running four on-demand waveform calculations. >> > 25% complete." >> > >> > So if after completion you select a region and amplify it, as soon >> > as there is no more mouse activity the progress message returns. >> > Can we fix these two issues? >> >> >> Good catch. I think now I've patched these two up. Let me know if >> something looks fishy. > > On Windows XP I'm still only getting "on-demand import complete" > as the final message (which disappears for good once you move > the mouse) in about 10% of cases. This is what you want to happen > isn't it? I'm not sure what David meant to say in his comment. > > In the other 90% of cases I still get left with "Import complete. > Running an on-demand waveform calculation. 100% complete" > which returns as soon as there is no mouse activity. I've changed some things that should fix it on PC. It also won't flash the subliminal complete messages as the individual tasks finish, but now only after the final task. > > I cannot find any pattern with number/length of files imported, whether > imported simultaneously or not, whether clicked in track or not that > makes this happen for sure. All I can say is that: > > * "on-demand import complete" does subliminally appear before being > replaced with "Import complete..." > > * If "Import complete" gets stuck in the Status Bar, importing a further > individual OD file will "usually" get rid of it and replace it with > "on-demand import complete". > > A pedantic comment... > > * We should capitalise the "o" of "on" in "on-demand import > complete". > > * There is a little bit of wooliness about the meaning of "import". > It means both the progress dialogue part the user will never > see with short files (after which the Status Bar says "Import > complete. Calculating waveform..."); plus completion of the > entire process of the import and calculation. Unless you were > following the Status Bar progress it would be possible to > wonder when you see the message "on-demand import complete" > if the calculation had stalled. Maybe "On-demand import and > calculation complete" is a mouthful, but more accurate. and waveform calculation complete" because we use the "waveform calculation" phrase during the progress. Michael > > > > Gale > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Come build with us! The BlackBerry(R) Developer Conference in SF, CA > is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your > developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay > ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9 - 12, 2009. Register now! > http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconference > _______________________________________________ > audacity-devel mailing list > [hidden email] > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Come build with us! The BlackBerry(R) Developer Conference in SF, CA is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9 - 12, 2009. Register now! http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconference _______________________________________________ audacity-devel mailing list [hidden email] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel |
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Gale (Audacity Team)
|
| From Michael Chinen <[hidden email]> | Sat, 10 Oct 2009 16:44:26 +0200 | Subject: [Audacity-devel] PC/Linux sanity check for OD loading > On Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 3:31 AM, Gale Andrews <[hidden email]> wrote: > >> >> > Hi Michael > >> >> > > >> >> > I tested it just now on Win XP, after updating to the latest > >> >> > 1.31 version of ODManager.cpp. I tried with three 5-minute > >> >> > 44100 Hz WAVs, dragged in together, then closed the > >> >> > project and dragged them in individually instead. > >> >> > > >> >> > There is no real hang or excessive CPU use in terms of > >> >> > Audacity being unresponsive, but the waveform calculation > >> >> > never completes after import. At best (when importing a > >> >> > single file), I got the first minute calculated. > >> >> > > >> >> > To view the waveform, I had to amplify it. Note this always > >> >> > shows the required "Amplification (dB)" as 0.0 irrespective > >> >> > of the actual volume of the track, and doesn't actually apply > >> >> > any amplification. Amplification seems correct if redone > >> >> > (I assume this is all expected given no calculation was done). > >> >> > > >> >> > It isn't possible here to quit Audacity without force-quitting, > >> >> > once an OD file has been imported. I *can* clear to an > >> >> > empty project by unchecking "Closing last window quits... " > >> >> > in Preferences. > >> >> > > >> >> > The Status Bar message correctly reflects the % of waveform > >> >> > that has been calculated (disappearing after Amplify has > >> >> > completed the calculation). > >> >> > > >> >> > The quoted number of on-demand waveform calculations > >> >> > seems to be more than one per track after your change. One > >> >> > five-minute track reported 7 calculations when I imported it > >> >> > on its own. After clearing to an new project and importing a > >> >> > similar file, there were only 2 calculations going on for that > >> >> > file. Can you explain a bit more about that, because the Manual > >> >> > would be affected by this. > >> >> > > >> >> > NB I have built into an empty directory, so am confident of the > >> >> > result. > >> >> > >> >> Hi Gale, could you please try it again. Also if Al or another linuxer > >> >> would verify it still works there, that would be great. > >> > > >> > The waveforms now complete on Win XP, and I can exit Audacity OK. > >> > > >> > As to speed improvements, I tested simultaneously importing two WAV > >> > files lasting an hour each. On the basis of three tests in 1.3.9 Release > >> > and three in 1.3.10, the average time to complete was 76 seconds in > >> > 1.3.9 Release and 62 seconds in 1.3.10. > >> > > >> > Although the number of calculations is now the same as the number of > >> > tracks imported, the overall calculation given in the Status Bar is > >> > dividing the result by the number of tracks. So if you import four files, > >> > the waveforms complete when the message says "Overall 25% complete". > >> > 1.3.9 has the same issue. > >> > > >> > A problem new to 1.3.10 is that although you get the "Calculating > >> > waveform 100% complete" message on mouseover, you can never get > >> > rid of the "progress" message in the status bar e.g. > >> > > >> > "Import complete. Running four on-demand waveform calculations. > >> > 25% complete." > >> > > >> > So if after completion you select a region and amplify it, as soon > >> > as there is no more mouse activity the progress message returns. > >> > Can we fix these two issues? > >> > >> > >> Good catch. I think now I've patched these two up. Let me know if > >> something looks fishy. Now I see ; "catch"... "fishy" ..... :=) > > On Windows XP I'm still only getting "on-demand import complete" > > as the final message (which disappears for good once you move > > the mouse) in about 10% of cases. This is what you want to happen > > isn't it? I'm not sure what David meant to say in his comment. > > > > In the other 90% of cases I still get left with "Import complete. > > Running an on-demand waveform calculation. 100% complete" > > which returns as soon as there is no mouse activity. > I couldn't reproduce this even once on 2 macs so I can't be sure, but > I've changed some things that should fix it on PC. It also won't > flash the subliminal complete messages as the individual tasks finish, > but now only after the final task. The problem was exactly the same on Linux too, but I've updated and checked Win XP and Ubuntu and you seem to have fixed it completely this time. When the last OD import completes, the correct "On-demand import and waveform calculation complete." message appears until you move the mouse, then it disappears for good. Thanks Gale > > I cannot find any pattern with number/length of files imported, whether > > imported simultaneously or not, whether clicked in track or not that > > makes this happen for sure. All I can say is that: > > > > * "on-demand import complete" does subliminally appear before being > > replaced with "Import complete..." > > > > * If "Import complete" gets stuck in the Status Bar, importing a further > > individual OD file will "usually" get rid of it and replace it with > > "on-demand import complete". > > > > A pedantic comment... > > > > * We should capitalise the "o" of "on" in "on-demand import > > complete". > > > > * There is a little bit of wooliness about the meaning of "import". > > It means both the progress dialogue part the user will never > > see with short files (after which the Status Bar says "Import > > complete. Calculating waveform..."); plus completion of the > > entire process of the import and calculation. Unless you were > > following the Status Bar progress it would be possible to > > wonder when you see the message "on-demand import complete" > > if the calculation had stalled. Maybe "On-demand import and > > calculation complete" is a mouthful, but more accurate. > Yes, I remember the discussions. I've changed it to "On-demand import > and waveform calculation complete" because we use the "waveform > calculation" phrase during the progress. > > Michael ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Come build with us! The BlackBerry(R) Developer Conference in SF, CA is the only developer event you need to attend this year. Jumpstart your developing skills, take BlackBerry mobile applications to market and stay ahead of the curve. Join us from November 9 - 12, 2009. Register now! http://p.sf.net/sfu/devconference _______________________________________________ audacity-devel mailing list [hidden email] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/audacity-devel |
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