NRLCA vs the National Board

[Noppie]

My questions for ALAN
1.  First what is the National Board?
2.  What is purpose of the National Board?
3.  Since the National Board dictates what the NRLCA can and can not do, what is the purpose of the union then?
4.  Is the National Board the ones responsible for writing the contract in a manner so vague that it difficult to enforce?
5.  Is the National Board the ones responsible coming up with ideal of taking away vehicles on Rural Route and having carrier supply their own vehicles at their own expense?
6.  Is the National Board the ones responsible taking away career status and benefits from the RCAs?
7.  Is the National Board the ones responsible not wanting Rural Letter Carriers to be able to apply their RCA time to their careers?
8  Can the NRLCA dissolve or remove the National Board from the discussion making process?
9.  Again if the National Board can dictate all policies concerning NRLCA. what is the point of the NRLCA?
10.  So you are applying for the job as a PUPPET?

Please explain how that is to motivated me into believing you are going to do anything noteworthy?

Given what appears to a very unhealthy relationship between the USPS aka National Board  and and the NRLCA.  We would be better off decertify the NRLCA and working without a union and be bond LABOR Laws.  Then working for a UNION that is controlled by the USPS which got legal permission to violated the FLSA Act.  Once under the FLSA Act we could no longer be told to WORK for FREE!!

I support Decertifying the NRLCA

 

Steven Noppenberger
RR28 Rural Letter carrier
Westminster, Maryland 21158

[Just Alan]

Steven, The National Board is the officers and NRO's we elect to represent us in dealings with our employer.
 The NRLCA does not dictate what we can and cannot do for the most part, except of course for internal matters where the DOL might have interest in how we operate. The NRLCA does the best it can to improve our working conditions and pay and protect our rightd as workers. The NRLCA and the PO jointly write and negotiate our contract, and I would say thier lawyers are better than ours at getting "gray" areas included in there, when we should be keeping them out. I don't think any Contract should have the word "may" in it anywhere. The NRLCA is responsible for getting more carriers a company car than ever before, you need to remember our first POV's were horses and wagons, so we are improving here. I think the RCA's lost thier benefits and career status due to Federal Legislation that was not aimed at them but caught them up. I'm quite certain the NRLCA would prefer we get credit for our RCA time, again that would be something to negotiate for, unless a Federal law would prohibit it. Don't know about this next one, but I think that would be a mistake. We have to have people in the decision making process, this can't be done by mob-rule. If you are unhappy with who is there now, as a delegate you can vote them out. I am running for President to hopefully bring fresh ideas and attitudes to the National Board, not to be a puppet and surely not a dictator. One of my biggest concerns is how well the board would work with and support an out-sider who has not worked themselves up through the system. I can't agree with you on decertification.Alan

[Noppie]

ALAN
Thanks for taking time to answer my question about the board and who and what they are.  

I cannot argue what actually happen to remove benefits from the RCAs on the Rural side but not the PTFs on the city side.  Since I did not work for the Post Office at that time.  However given ever action taken by the NRLCA since 2001 (when I started at USPS).  The circumstance evidence based on their actions points to NRLCA doing it just to cause harm.  

The words spoken aloud by Maryland based stewards and other representatives of the NRLCA in my present suggested they were fundamentally opposed to the concept of supplying Postal Vehicles to rural routes.  When our Westminster PO was supposed to get Postal Vehicles many, many years ago.  We called begged and asked our MD State stewards.  They expressing that they were fundamentally opposed to the concept of supplying Postal Vehicles and would not take any action.

 just before I made regular.  I wrote and called Senator Mikulski, who in turn had a case worker contact me.  At one point I mentioned that Westminster PO was suppose be supplied vehicles many years ago.  Which she refused to believe that anyone HAVE TOO supply a vehicle to deliver the mail?  But would check into it.  First the PO said everyone who wanted a vehicle supplied received one.  Anyone who did not was allowed to supply a vehicle at their own expensive.  She had been explained by the USPS that EMA covered all expenses and allowed carrier to make a profit.  Which I explained was not true and that none of us where given an option?  Senator Mikulski office said they would sent a casework out the Westminster PO to visual check and to ask carriers.  At no point  did any case worker visit me at the Westminster PO.  And none of my fellow carriers mentioned every meeting a caseworker from Senator Mikulski office.  Senator Mikulski office stopped returning phone calls and ignored all letters afterwards.  

In March I was ORDER to supply a RHD vehicle at my expense or be fired.  The Maryland State steward Lynn Jones said she would support my postmaster in firing any carrier who did not supply a RHD vehicle.   I did purchase a RHD Jeep and submitted MOU #8 RHD Vehicle Incentive form 3 TIMES to my postmaster.  The third time he said he refused to sign it and for me to stop filling them out.  That form would have notified me if the USPS had plans on supplying LLV at some point and when.  7 of us purchased RHD Jeeps from US Drive Right.  Within weeks of my vehicle arriving and using it on the route we told that USPS would be supply us with LLVs. One of those carries received his LLV before his RHD Jeep was shipped.  

I did not receive my LLV till November. My LLV arrived on saturday after I completed my route.  Monday evening I received a call from Senator Mikulski office asking if I liked my LLV.  She was unable to help in other matters concerning the USPS.

I really think you need to reword your statement that NRLCA is behind or is responsible supply LLV's to rural carriers.  I had three rural carriers attempt to purchase my RHD Jeep.  Each would prefer to have government own vehicle supplied to their routes.  I have told everyone who asked way I was selling my RHD Jeep to contact their congressman or senator.  At least one was successful in getting a LLV after contacting their senator.  NO ONE was successful in asking the NRLCA to enforce their contract.

I am not blaming you.  I am blaming the NRLCA.  

And just to clarify you are saying that National Board are Rural Letter Carriers who have become NRLCA officials in some manners and are elected to that position.  In other post you mentioned that National Board is unwilling to take certain actions.  That because of they are opposed to those actions the NRCLA cannot move or enact those actions.  I have real issues with believing any former rural letter carrier would be opposed benefits, and many issues that every other union on the planet has allowed.

You are welcome to disagree with me on the need to decertify the NRLCA.  I still believe based on my personal experience with dealing with the NRLCA, they need to be decertified.  The NRLCA could prove me wrong with strong opposing the USPS and with recent mail count.  In my office the City Career Union does a radically better of communicating their position and defend the city carriers.  The NRLCA is dead silent.  AND has never been helpful at all.  It could change if it choose too.  

I am not a delegate.

My apologizes for such a long reply.

[*SUPERsub*]

i agree with west noppie...you will never decertify...nor would you actually want too...
but you just might be able to bring about some change...from WITHIN....think about it...

[Noppie]

Dear WestVirginia Carrier and *SUPERsub*
Thanks for reply and offering your opinions.  I have thought about it.  When in life you are faced with a choice and your are uncertain as to what to do.  You then choose the symbolic choice.  From my prospective the NRLCA is the very embodiment of evil.  They knowingly make choice to harm others.  They are not going to stop because you asked them nicely or because they action are wrong.

Joining the NRLCA on any level would be acknowledging and contributing to their actions that knowingly are causing harm.  No one would suggest joining the KKK to help out with race relationship.  Symbolically by joining you are saying you embrace what the NRLCA is and has done.  

You are hoping they will change.  You are hoping they will follow some set of rules that in turn will allow another group to change the direction of NRLCA.  You know HOPE is a PRAYER.  Have they ever followed any rules whether written or implied in the past.  If they have, it was only to suit their needs at that moment in time.

Let say for argument purposes a group would start via the INTERNET a 52 State program like Howard Dean attempted but the OBAMA used to win.  Say you did the math and you KNEW how many new members, along with pledges from existing members who would agree to vote for a NEW Sate steward and a NEW Delegate.  WHO have agreed in advance to VOTE on a pre-planned strategy to rewrite the NRLCA and unseat the National Board.  Do you really think the NRLCA is going to allow THAT.  A NRLCA that is up in your face working with USPS.  

If you waiting to a certain date and had ALL new member sign up as a symbolic message to NRLCA.  Gave each NEW member the form to exit the UNION as well.  AND also GAVE a petition that if for any reason UNION did not honor it own rules you would X numbers members willing decertify the union.  

Your method requires a risk, large numbers and relies on the NRLCA honoring it rules.  If you fail then YOU will be contributing to the nightmare vs fighting it.  Whereas my method is daunting but I will not be contributing to the nightmare if I lose.  Even I lose my symbolic message will be clear.  

[Noppie]

Just Alan wrote:

....... I think the RCA's lost their benefits and career status due to Federal Legislation that was not aimed at them but caught them up.

Dear Alan
I believe you need to look into the above quote by you.  And I realize you may have been told that and it took it at face value.  

For two reasons:
1.  Being on the face of it, it seem very unlikely.  Why would benefits be taken away from RCA's but not PTF's on the city side.  There are federal employees who do not work 40 hours yet receive benefits.

2.  If such a Federal Legislation does indeed exist and has not been addressed.  It does not manner how manny promises you or somebody else makes.  IF that Federal Legislation outlawed RCAs from having benefits, what to stop it from outlawing benefits in the future.

2a.  If such Federal Legislation does indeed exist.  This beyond the control of the NRLCA.  This action taken by congress and or the senate.

From my experience with the USPS and the NRLCA they ignore most laws anyway.  So why would they bother with following this Federal Legislation?  Besides the fact it caused harm to rural letter carriers.  

Thank you for taking time to answer and read questions  

[*SUPERsub*]

You actually make sense to me in a weird kind of way..cause I have persued that train of thought myself...

If you had the ability to call up some of my first ever posts on the boards..I WAS very anti-union...

however; they could care less if they lose members...they really dont care...there is still enough folks out there

that will send their money  blindly..and not raise a fuss about where it goes...I would prefer to be one of those that

actually wants a first hand accounting..of what they are doing...where they are spending...etc...

It would be MUCH easier on me to just butt out..and not worry about it...keep my cash..and use them when i need them...

but I would rather raise hell...and make em hear it..just my nature i guess!!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Noppie (via Nabble)" <[hidden email]>
To: "*SUPERsub*" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, April 6, 2009 4:37:00 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: NRLCA vs the National Board

Dear WestVirginia Carrier and *SUPERsub*
Thanks for reply and offering your opinions.  I have thought about it.  When in life you are faced with a choice and your are uncertain as to what to do.  You then choose the symbolic choice.  From my prospective embodiment the NRLCA is the very embodiment of evil.  They knowingly make choice to harm others.  They are not going to stop because you asked them nicely or because they action are wrong.

Joining the NRLCA on any level would be acknowledging and contributing to their actions that knowingly are causing harm.  No one would suggest joining the KKK to help out with race relationship.  Symbolically by joining you are saying you embrace what the NRLCA is and has done.  

You are hoping they will change.  You are hoping they will follow some set of rules that in turn will allow another group to change the direction of NRLCA.  You know HOPE is a PRAYER.  Have they ever followed any rules whether written or implied in the past.  If they have, it has only suit there needs at the time.

Let say for argument purposes a group would start via the INTERNET a 52 State program like Howard Dean attempted but the OBAMA used to win.  Say you did the math and you KNEW how many new members, along with pledges from existing members who would agree to vote for a NEW Sate steward and a NEW Delegate.  WHO have agreed in advance to VOTE on a pre-planned strategy to rewrite the NRLCA and unseat the National Board.  Do you really think the NRLCA is going to allow THAT.  A NRLCA that is up in your face working with USPS.  

If you waiting to a certain date and had ALL new member sign up as a symbolic message to NRLCA.  Gave each NEW member the form to exit the UNION as well.  AND also GAVE a petition that if for any reason UNION did not honor it own rules you would X numbers members willing decertify the union.  

Your method requires a risk, large numbers and relies on the NRLCA honoring it rules.  If you fail then YOU will be contributing to the nightmare vs fighting it.  Whereas my method is daunting but I will not be contributing to the nightmare if I lose.  Even I lose my symbolic message will be clear.  

---

This email is a reply to your post @ http://n2.nabble.com/NRLCA-vs-the-National-Board-tp2578436p2595602.html
You can reply by email or by visting the link above.

[ruralflunky]

Yes, I keep hearing that the RCAs lost their benefits and career status due to Federal Legislation that was not aimed at them but caught them up in it, but I believe they were caught up in it because the NRLCA and the USPS can't agree to make them CAREER.  Yes they made the Rural Carrier PTF position, but there seems to be grey language surrounding this promotion.  
I thought that when a office was converted to a formula office that they would promote an RCA to this career PTF position, but I am hearing where all over the Country they are not doing this.  It must not be a requirement to convert a RCA  to PTF or someone is not following the Contract, or it was quietly omitted from the Contract.

[Noppie]

Some javascript/style in this post has been disabled (why?)

I hear many things as to why the RCA lost their benefits.  % or 6 years ago in my office in Westminster Maryland they took away a lot saturdays off for routes that had subs and had in the past had saturday off.  We filed a grievance with Md State steward however she refused follow up or ask the USPS to enforce the contract.  

And I believe her answer was for her to move forward on any grievance she had to approve of it in advance.  Her reasoning for not following up on any grievance is the NRLCA ha decide that USPS could interpreted the contract even beyond plain english understanding.  

 

On Apr 12, 2009, at 7:03 PM, ruralflunky (via Nabble) wrote:

Yes, I keep hearing that the RCAs lost their benefits and career status due to Federal Legislation that was not aimed at them but caught them up in it, but I believe they were caught up in it because the NRLCA and the USPS can't agree to make them CAREER.  Yes they made the Rural Carrier PTF position, but there seems to be grey language surrounding this promotion.  
I thought that when a office was converted to a formula office that they would promote an RCA to this career PTF position, but I am hearing where all over the Country they are not doing this.  It must not be a requirement to convert a RCA  to PTF or someone is not following the Contract, or it was quietly omitted from the Contract.