Ericsson releases "free" cell-id lookup API

[Alex (Maxious) Sadleir]

https://labs.ericsson.com/apis/mobile-location/documentation/cell-id-look-up-api

Limited to 100 requests per day. Perhaps I'm getting the syntax wrong
(made sure to use hex like their example does) but when I tried to
compare it to cells in the openmoko cellid databases, I got back "404
- The requested resource () is not available."

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[Baruch Even]

Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote:
> https://labs.ericsson.com/apis/mobile-location/documentation/cell-id-look-up-api
>
> Limited to 100 requests per day. Perhaps I'm getting the syntax wrong
> (made sure to use hex like their example does) but when I tried to
> compare it to cells in the openmoko cellid databases, I got back "404
> - The requested resource () is not available."

The main limitation of such APIs is that you have to be online to use
them, so you must use a GPRS connection to get your location.
openbmap-locator can work offline as well.

Baruch

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[Jim Morris]

Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote:
> https://labs.ericsson.com/apis/mobile-location/documentation/cell-id-look-up-api
>
> Limited to 100 requests per day. Perhaps I'm getting the syntax wrong
> (made sure to use hex like their example does) but when I tried to
> compare it to cells in the openmoko cellid databases, I got back "404
> - The requested resource () is not available."
>

According to the API that means the cellid was not in the database. you would get a 400 if the
parameters were wrong.

--
Jim Morris, http://blog.wolfman.com

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[jluis]

El Thursday, 22 de October de 2009 06:19:45 Baruch Even va escriure:
> The main limitation of such APIs is that you have to be online to use
> them, so you must use a GPRS connection to get your location.
> openbmap-locator can work offline as well.

It Also has bad data.I've tested it for some cells in my neighbourhood look
like I'm teleported 481km North-West and the cell area has a radius of 3.3 km

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[Onen]

Baruch Even wrote:

> Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote:
>> https://labs.ericsson.com/apis/mobile-location/documentation/cell-id-look-up-api
>>
>> Limited to 100 requests per day. Perhaps I'm getting the syntax wrong
>> (made sure to use hex like their example does) but when I tried to
>> compare it to cells in the openmoko cellid databases, I got back "404
>> - The requested resource () is not available."
>
> The main limitation of such APIs is that you have to be online to use
> them, so you must use a GPRS connection to get your location.
> openbmap-locator can work offline as well.
>

Is it very much different than the Google location API?

As Baruch said, you must be online, and I add you must send your GSM
data (and as such your position) to a third party.
Local service on the phone as openBmap-locator from Baruch is the right
way to go for performance, easiness, and privacy.

Onen


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[Alex (Maxious) Sadleir]

2009/10/23 Onen <[hidden email]>:

> Baruch Even wrote:
>> Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote:
>>> https://labs.ericsson.com/apis/mobile-location/documentation/cell-id-look-up-api
>>>
>>> Limited to 100 requests per day. Perhaps I'm getting the syntax wrong
>>> (made sure to use hex like their example does) but when I tried to
>>> compare it to cells in the openmoko cellid databases, I got back "404
>>> - The requested resource () is not available."
>>
>> The main limitation of such APIs is that you have to be online to use
>> them, so you must use a GPRS connection to get your location.
>> openbmap-locator can work offline as well.
>>
>
> Is it very much different than the Google location API?

Definately - It only gives you 1 cell position (latitude/longitude, is
this the position of the cell tower?), a locality name and an accuracy
measure in meters per API call. This is unlike the Google API where
the whole locating operation can be considered server side and other
attributes such as rxlevel and timing advance can be considered. So
you would have to develop your own application to combine results from
both serving and neighbour cells in a meaningful way (their example
only tells you the serving cell location) and you still would not have
rxlevel/timing advance information.


> As Baruch said, you must be online, and I add you must send your GSM
> data (and as such your position) to a third party.
> Local service on the phone as openBmap-locator from Baruch is the right
> way to go for performance, easiness, and privacy.
I look forward to this :)

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[Baruch Even]

Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote:
> 2009/10/23 Onen <[hidden email]>:
>> Baruch Even wrote:
>>> Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote:
>
>> As Baruch said, you must be online, and I add you must send your GSM
>> data (and as such your position) to a third party.
>> Local service on the phone as openBmap-locator from Baruch is the right
>> way to go for performance, easiness, and privacy.
> I look forward to this :)

Search for openbmap-locator, it already exists. Though it's still
somewhat limited.

Baruch

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[jeanmatthew]

> Is it very much different than the Google location API?
>Definately - It only gives you 1 cell position (latitude/longitude, is
>this the position of the cell tower?), a locality name and an accuracy
>measure in meters per API call. This is unlike the Google API where
>the whole locating operation can be considered server side and other
>attributes such as rxlevel and timing advance can be considered. So
>you would have to develop your own application to combine results from
>both serving and neighbour cells in a meaningful way (their example
>only tells you the serving cell location) and you still would not have
>rxlevel/timing advance information.

All cell-id based positioning is done server side (unless you have the whole database in your device) Do you have any indication that Google is using rxlevels and timing advance? Are there any devices that supports access to these measures? To do any kind of combination you still need to extract all of the data from the device and send to the server. Google doesn't have access to any kind of data from the network.

Would be interesting with some more information around this if you have.

[Alex (Maxious) Sadleir]

2009/11/3 jeanmatthew <[hidden email]>:

>
>> Is it very much different than the Google location API?
>>Definately - It only gives you 1 cell position (latitude/longitude, is
>>this the position of the cell tower?), a locality name and an accuracy
>>measure in meters per API call. This is unlike the Google API where
>>the whole locating operation can be considered server side and other
>>attributes such as rxlevel and timing advance can be considered. So
>>you would have to develop your own application to combine results from
>>both serving and neighbour cells in a meaningful way (their example
>>only tells you the serving cell location) and you still would not have
>>rxlevel/timing advance information.
>
> All cell-id based positioning is done server side (unless you have the whole
> database in your device)

Which is the intention of openbmap-locator

> Do you have any indication that Google is using
> rxlevels and timing advance?
http://code.google.com/apis/gears/geolocation_network_protocol.html

See the "signal_strength" and "timing_advance" specifications for more detail.

> Are there any devices that supports access to
> these measures? To do any kind of combination you still need to extract all
> of the data from the device and send to the server. Google doesn't have
> access to any kind of data from the network.

Google Maps apps even on pre-android phones (Java Mobile Edition) have
had access to cell-id via the various proprietary java interfaces
(com.sonyericsson.net.cellid,
net.rim.device.api.system.GPRSInfo.getCellInfo().getCellId() on the
blackberry etc). These interfaces are what allowed the OpenCellID
project to exist before the freerunner was released.

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[jeanmatthew]

>> Are there any devices that supports access to
>> these measures? To do any kind of combination you still need to extract all
>> of the data from the device and send to the server. Google doesn't have
>> access to any kind of data from the network.

>Google Maps apps even on pre-android phones (Java Mobile Edition) have
>had access to cell-id via the various proprietary java interfaces
>(com.sonyericsson.net.cellid,
>net.rim.device.api.system.GPRSInfo.getCellInfo().getCellId() on the
>blackberry etc). These interfaces are what allowed the OpenCellID
>project to exist before the freerunner was released.

But are there any devices that support the reading of signal_strength and timing_advance from all neighbouring cells so that these can be supplied in the request to the Geolocation Network API? The proprietary interfaces I have seen only supports the cell you are currently registered to and not the neighbours.

[tomsoft]

 Agree, as far as I know, there is no way to most on the device to
access to these informations. What I know is that now Google Map use
frequently location provided by operators (and not by their own
database). On the operator side, you can have a better location than
just the cell because the networks also knows the neighbouring cells
and other parameters, but this require changes or new equipement in
the network, which is costly.


2009/11/3 jeanmatthew <[hidden email]>:

>
>>> Are there any devices that supports access to
>>> these measures? To do any kind of combination you still need to extract
> all
>>> of the data from the device and send to the server. Google doesn't have
>>> access to any kind of data from the network.
>
>>Google Maps apps even on pre-android phones (Java Mobile Edition) have
>>had access to cell-id via the various proprietary java interfaces
>>(com.sonyericsson.net.cellid,
>>net.rim.device.api.system.GPRSInfo.getCellInfo().getCellId() on the
>>blackberry etc). These interfaces are what allowed the OpenCellID
>>project to exist before the freerunner was released.
>
> But are there any devices that support the reading of signal_strength and
> timing_advance from all neighbouring cells so that these can be supplied in
> the request to the Geolocation Network API? The proprietary interfaces I
> have seen only supports the cell you are currently registered to and not the
> neighbours.
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/Ericsson-releases-free-cell-id-lookup-API-tp3869908p3937224.html
> Sent from the Openmoko Community mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
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--
Thomas LANDSPURG
8Motions
Founder/CTO
http://www.8motions.com
http://www.opencellid.org

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