CMS for website

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Robert Leverington

CMS for website

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Hi,

Currently I am setting up the new website server.  The proposal was to
use Wordpress.

What does everyone think of this?

Robert


Richard Thompson-2

Re: CMS for website

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2009/7/18 Robert Leverington <[hidden email]>
Hi,

Currently I am setting up the new website server.  The proposal was to
use Wordpress.

What does everyone think of this?

Robert


Seems good to me :)

--
Richard Thompson
Tim Dobson-2

Re: CMS for website

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Robert Leverington wrote:
> Currently I am setting up the new website server.  The proposal was to
> use Wordpress.
>
> What does everyone think of this?

I was actually going to suggest Poliglota for this.

I think the getgnulinux.org approach to the dfey.org website would
actually be quite refreshing:

http://tracker.gnulinuxmatters.org/wiki/Poliglota

With reference to getgnulinux.org

Tim


Robert Leverington

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On 2009-07-18, Tim Dobson wrote:
> I was actually going to suggest Poliglota for this.
>
> I think the getgnulinux.org approach to the dfey.org website would  
> actually be quite refreshing:
>
> http://tracker.gnulinuxmatters.org/wiki/Poliglota
>
> With reference to getgnulinux.org

What benefit does this offer?  I can't tell if there is really anything
we want that it can do and other packages cannot. Among other things it
will have the disadvantage of being much harder to tie user accounts
with other things like the wiki.

Robert


Stephen Mount-2

Re: CMS for website

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Oh my...

On 18 Jul 2009, at 17:53, Robert Leverington wrote:

> On 2009-07-18, Tim Dobson wrote:
>> I was actually going to suggest Poliglota for this.
>>
>> I think the getgnulinux.org approach to the dfey.org website would
>> actually be quite refreshing:
>>
>> http://tracker.gnulinuxmatters.org/wiki/Poliglota
>>
>> With reference to getgnulinux.org
>
> What benefit does this offer?  I can't tell if there is really  
> anything
> we want that it can do and other packages cannot. Among other things  
> it
> will have the disadvantage of being much harder to tie user accounts
> with other things like the wiki.
>
> Robert
>
>



Tim Dobson-2

Re: CMS for website

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Robert Leverington wrote:

> On 2009-07-18, Tim Dobson wrote:
>> I was actually going to suggest Poliglota for this.
>>
>> I think the getgnulinux.org approach to the dfey.org website would  
>> actually be quite refreshing:
>>
>> http://tracker.gnulinuxmatters.org/wiki/Poliglota
>>
>> With reference to getgnulinux.org
>
> What benefit does this offer?  I can't tell if there is really anything
> we want that it can do and other packages cannot. Among other things it
> will have the disadvantage of being much harder to tie user accounts
> with other things like the wiki.

Sorry for the slowish response - as you know I was giving a presentation
on DFEY at Becta's Open Source Schools Unconference and I spent a lot of
time I should have spent doing things/answering email, writing and
practising my talk.

Well first it would be helpful to look at our requirements and what
other organisations with similar requirements have done.


One thing that might be worth bearing in mind is the consideration that
it might not necessarily be desirable to have user accounts.

If we look at an organisation which uses wordpress - Manchester Free
Software Group - http://manchester.fsuk.org - we can see that the actual
people who update it are very few - I have credentials to add articles
etc. but I wouldn't consider adding the latest article on my blog -
apart from it not really being keeping with the nature of the blog, I'd
instantly get lynched (it's a metaphor!) from the other members of group
who might feel I was not expressing my views in the right place.
Equally I'd feel the same way if someone else wrote an article on it
about their favourite programs on "linux".

I think teenlinux.com is offline/a holder page but if we look back a
months on the internet archive, they are using drupal.

They were a single community, online and but it's crucial to note that
only a few limited people could and would write things onto the front page.

I've not looked at teensonlinux.com for a while, but as a 'rival' (in
the very broadest use of the term) online teenage linux community, they
adopted joomla.

But these are not organisations who we share many great similarities
with structurally...

lug.org.uk - UK Linux User Groups - are a group of disparate local area
groups provided with infrastructure, support and to some degree,
direction, I feel to some extent represents more where we stand.

I feel that a simplistic static homepage structure - as offered by
poliglota, offers a good basis for our homepage and what we do.

Thoughts?

Tim



Tim Dobson-2

Re: CMS for website

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Robert Leverington wrote:
> What benefit does this offer?  I can't tell if there is really anything
> we want that it can do and other packages cannot. Among other things it
> will have the disadvantage of being much harder to tie user accounts
> with other things like the wiki.

Also why are we moving to a VPS for "more flexibility" when wordpress is
one of the least demanding pieces of software written in php out there?

I mean, I'm not suggesting we should be using thinks for the sake of it
being difficult but it does raise some serious questions - what
"flexibility" are we currently lacking?

Tim


Robert Leverington

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On 2009-07-22, Tim Dobson wrote:
> Also why are we moving to a VPS for "more flexibility" when wordpress is  
> one of the least demanding pieces of software written in php out there?
>
> I mean, I'm not suggesting we should be using thinks for the sake of it  
> being difficult but it does raise some serious questions - what  
> "flexibility" are we currently lacking?
>

Before we rented a VPS DFEY did not have any hosting specific to it,
everything was running on members personal hosting (at least this is my
impression, correct me if I'm wrong).  Therefore the comparison of
flexibility is essentially between shared hosting and a VPS, since there
was no real "before and after" points.  Compared to a "regular" shared
hosting account VPS has the benefit of:
    - Multiple people being able to have the highest level of access to
      the "account", for example multiple sudoers can be defined.  This
      means that when members come and go from the group (which will
      inevitably happen in a group aimed at young people) the hosting
      will not dissapear with them or require any migration.
    - The ability to chose what applications DFEY wants to use and
      install applications not normally available.  I know that there
      was trouble with image rendering software where the DFEY-NW wiki
      is currently hosted, having a VPS means this can easily be
      resolved.
    - Being able to do more than just host the websites and e-mail.  For
      a decent shared host you are probably going to have to pay around
      £5/month anyway, and with a VPS there are additional utillities
      such as the shell accounts (which I know at least three people are
      currently using permanently to some degree).
    - Resolving most of our own issues is possible.  With a shared host
      there may have been significant waiting when problems arise and
      you are always at the mercy of changes by the provider, there is
      not the same level of integration with the provider on a VPS so it
      is not an issue so much at all.

Robert


Robert Leverington

Re: CMS for website

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In reply to this post by Tim Dobson-2
On 2009-07-22, Tim Dobson wrote:

> Sorry for the slowish response - as you know I was giving a presentation  
> on DFEY at Becta's Open Source Schools Unconference and I spent a lot of  
> time I should have spent doing things/answering email, writing and  
> practising my talk.
>
> Well first it would be helpful to look at our requirements and what  
> other organisations with similar requirements have done.
>
>
> One thing that might be worth bearing in mind is the consideration that  
> it might not necessarily be desirable to have user accounts.
>
> If we look at an organisation which uses wordpress - Manchester Free  
> Software Group - http://manchester.fsuk.org - we can see that the actual  
> people who update it are very few - I have credentials to add articles  
> etc. but I wouldn't consider adding the latest article on my blog -  
> apart from it not really being keeping with the nature of the blog, I'd  
> instantly get lynched (it's a metaphor!) from the other members of group  
> who might feel I was not expressing my views in the right place.
> Equally I'd feel the same way if someone else wrote an article on it  
> about their favourite programs on "linux".
>
> I think teenlinux.com is offline/a holder page but if we look back a  
> months on the internet archive, they are using drupal.
>
> They were a single community, online and but it's crucial to note that  
> only a few limited people could and would write things onto the front
> page.
>
> I've not looked at teensonlinux.com for a while, but as a 'rival' (in  
> the very broadest use of the term) online teenage linux community, they  
> adopted joomla.
>
> But these are not organisations who we share many great similarities  
> with structurally...
>
> lug.org.uk - UK Linux User Groups - are a group of disparate local area  
> groups provided with infrastructure, support and to some degree,  
> direction, I feel to some extent represents more where we stand.
>
> I feel that a simplistic static homepage structure - as offered by  
> poliglota, offers a good basis for our homepage and what we do.
>
> Thoughts?

You make some interesting suggestions, that seem to me to be quite
sensible.  If we go for a more static site there won't be the need to
monitor who is updating it since all the content will be agreed upon in
advanced (we could use pages on the wiki to organise this, but I haven't
really thought that through).  Furthermore agreeing upon all the content
before posting it live is likely to significantly reduce drama
considerably.

The general idea we discussed on IRC was that we would use the CMS for a
news feed and having a few static pages, but thinking about it further it
seems unlikely that there will be so much news and a firm system for
managing static content seems the way forward.

Robert


Stephen Mount-2

Re: CMS for website

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They just want IRC bouncers; leave them alone!

On 22 Jul 2009, at 01:14, Tim Dobson wrote:

> Robert Leverington wrote:
>> What benefit does this offer?  I can't tell if there is really  
>> anything
>> we want that it can do and other packages cannot. Among other  
>> things it
>> will have the disadvantage of being much harder to tie user accounts
>> with other things like the wiki.
>
> Also why are we moving to a VPS for "more flexibility" when  
> wordpress is one of the least demanding pieces of software written  
> in php out there?
>
> I mean, I'm not suggesting we should be using thinks for the sake of  
> it being difficult but it does raise some serious questions - what  
> "flexibility" are we currently lacking?
>
> Tim
>
>



x_rob

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I personally think it is a bit of a waste of money.... The only real
thing it's being used for atm is irssi over SSH. We could've got what
we needed for about £20 per year in all honesty.... I don't think we
ever really needed this much flexibility.

As long as we have people willing to front the money though, i see no
need to switch.

On 7/18/09, Tim Dobson <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Robert Leverington wrote:
>> Currently I am setting up the new website server.  The proposal was to
>> use Wordpress.
>>
>> What does everyone think of this?
>
> I was actually going to suggest Poliglota for this.
>
> I think the getgnulinux.org approach to the dfey.org website would
> actually be quite refreshing:
>
> http://tracker.gnulinuxmatters.org/wiki/Poliglota
>
> With reference to getgnulinux.org
>
> Tim
>
>
>

--
Sent from my mobile device


Richard Thompson-2

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2009/7/22 Rob Barry <[hidden email]>
I personally think it is a bit of a waste of money.... The only real
thing it's being used for atm is irssi over SSH. We could've got what
we needed for about £20 per year in all honesty.... I don't think we
ever really needed this much flexibility.

As long as we have people willing to front the money though, i see no
need to switch.

On 7/18/09, Tim Dobson <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Robert Leverington wrote:
>> Currently I am setting up the new website server.  The proposal was to
>> use Wordpress.
>>
>> What does everyone think of this?
>
> I was actually going to suggest Poliglota for this.
>
> I think the getgnulinux.org approach to the dfey.org website would
> actually be quite refreshing:
>
> http://tracker.gnulinuxmatters.org/wiki/Poliglota
>
> With reference to getgnulinux.org
>
> Tim
>
>
>

--
Sent from my mobile device


We were going to have mail, but that has not been set up yet


--
Richard
Isabell Long

Re: CMS for website

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On 22/07/2009, Rob Barry <[hidden email]> wrote:
> I personally think it is a bit of a waste of money.... The only real
> thing it's being used for atm is irssi over SSH. We could've got what
> we needed for about £20 per year in all honesty.... I don't think we
> ever really needed this much flexibility.
>
> As long as we have people willing to front the money though, i see no
> need to switch.

But we have only just got it and there are people willing to pay so
there is no real point switching now as people do use it, even if only
for irssi over SSH.  Though yes they could get that from somewhere
else.

--
Regards,
Isabell Long.  <[hidden email]>
[[User:Isabell121]] on all public Wikimedia projects.


Connor Smith

Re: CMS for website

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On Wed, 2009-07-22 at 14:07 +0100, Rob Barry wrote:
> I personally think it is a bit of a waste of money.... The only real
> thing it's being used for atm is irssi over SSH. We could've got what
> we needed for about £20 per year in all honesty.... I don't think we
> ever really needed this much flexibility.
>
> As long as we have people willing to front the money though, i see no
> need to switch.

As people are willing to pay, and the pros outweigh the cons (which is
why the people who are paying for it are), I see no issue with our
having a VPS. The only argument I have seen put forward is it being
"overkill", which isn't a drawback in and of itself.

Clearly it is useful to certain members of the community, and as they
are those who are paying for it, Dogfish could perhaps be viewed as a
gift which they are providing to the rest of us free of charge - and, in
that light, I'm sure all of us who use it are grateful. And anyone who
doesn't use it doesn't need to care either way...

Thanks,

cls



x_rob

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2009/7/22 Richard Thompson <[hidden email]>
We were going to have mail, but that has not been set up yet


--
Richard
Yeah, and a £20 per annum server can't provide that now?

2009/7/22 Connor Smith <[hidden email]> wrote:

>The only argument I have seen put forward is it being
>"overkill", which isn't a drawback in and of itself.

So you're saying something unnecessary which is akin to bloat isn't a drawback?
Richard Thompson-2

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2009/7/22 Rob Barry <[hidden email]>


2009/7/22 Richard Thompson <[hidden email]>

We were going to have mail, but that has not been set up yet


--
Richard
Yeah, and a £20 per annum server can't provide that now?

 
2009/7/22 Connor Smith <[hidden email]> wrote:

>The only argument I have seen put forward is it being
>"overkill", which isn't a drawback in and of itself.

So you're saying something unnecessary which is akin to bloat isn't a drawback?


    Rob, if you think the VPS is a bad idea, why are you paying like 50% of the cost of running it?

--
Richard
x_rob

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2009/7/22 Richard Thompson <[hidden email]>


2009/7/22 Rob Barry <[hidden email]>


2009/7/22 Richard Thompson <[hidden email]>

We were going to have mail, but that has not been set up yet


--
Richard
Yeah, and a £20 per annum server can't provide that now?

 
2009/7/22 Connor Smith <[hidden email]> wrote:

>The only argument I have seen put forward is it being
>"overkill", which isn't a drawback in and of itself.

So you're saying something unnecessary which is akin to bloat isn't a drawback?


    Rob, if you think the VPS is a bad idea, why are you paying like 50% of the cost of running it?

--
Richard

I'm paying for it?! News to me.
Richard Thompson-2

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2009/7/22 Rob Barry <[hidden email]>


2009/7/22 Richard Thompson <[hidden email]>


2009/7/22 Rob Barry <[hidden email]>


2009/7/22 Richard Thompson <[hidden email]>

We were going to have mail, but that has not been set up yet


--
Richard
Yeah, and a £20 per annum server can't provide that now?

 
2009/7/22 Connor Smith <[hidden email]> wrote:

>The only argument I have seen put forward is it being
>"overkill", which isn't a drawback in and of itself.

So you're saying something unnecessary which is akin to bloat isn't a drawback?


    Rob, if you think the VPS is a bad idea, why are you paying like 50% of the cost of running it?

--
Richard

I'm paying for it?! News to me.

I confused you with Robert Leverington :(

--
Richard
Robert Leverington

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On 2009-07-22, Richard Thompson wrote:
>     Rob, if you think the VPS is a bad idea, why are you paying like 50% of
> the cost of running it?

He isn't, that is me.

Robert


Richard Thompson-2

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2009/7/22 Robert Leverington <[hidden email]>
On 2009-07-22, Richard Thompson wrote:
>     Rob, if you think the VPS is a bad idea, why are you paying like 50% of
> the cost of running it?

He isn't, that is me.

Robert


I know, I was dumb, god, leave me alone, <cries in a corner>


--
Richard
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